Living the Could Life

Living The Could Life Workbook Primer

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 30 Jun 2026 18:31:32 +0000

A Bit More About the Living The Could Life Workbook

In this episode we address some questions about our guided workbook. The gentle aspect of the book led to a few inquiries about the effectiveness of this 70-dday guide. We wanted to take an episode to dive deeper into the focus of the book and the importance of reading the intro and other parts of the workbook. We talk a bit of acetylcholine, Goldilocks and how relative stress may be.

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AS AN AMAZON ASSOCIATE I EARN FROM QUALIFYING PURCHASES.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Theresa: Welcome back to Living the Good Life, where we talk about real travel for real bodies. The kind of trips you can actually take, not the ones that you used to be able to take. I'm Teresa. Today we're talking about how real change happens in the brain, not through force, not through intensity, not through try harder, but through gentle, meaningful challenge. Inside the brain, there's a chemical called acetylcholine. Think of it as your brain's spotlight operator. When something is new, interesting, or requires your attention, acetylcholine turns the spotlight on and says, hey, this matters. Let's strengthen it. For example, if something is too easy, something you can do on autopilot, your brain doesn't bother requiring anything it thinks. Oh, we already know how to do this. So let's make this real with an example. People often say, I do Wyrtle every day. Isn't that good for my brain? And the answer is, it's fun, but it doesn't create any new connections. So acetylcholine barely moves. No spotlight, no rewiring. And my guess is, it makes fewer connections if you learn a second romance language. What do you think? As opposed to a Germanic language. Robert: I guess the grammar is different. Like German, the joke is they always wait for the end of the sentence. Theresa: Right. We should do that for this podcast. Make you wait. Robert: And yeah, I hear people say learning Greek is very difficult, where they say learning Spanish is a lot easier, but when you start becoming really fluent in Spanish, it's still pretty, pretty challenging, I think. Theresa: And I think other languages, like some of the Asian languages or Chinese, which is, I believe, called a tonal language, where, you know, high, high pitch. I know they use the example ma, like there's several different ways to pronounce ma, and it totally changes the meaning. But anyway, I was just wondering about that. I don't know. So, back to language. Your brain can't solve, learn, you know, a problem, the problem of learning a new language with its old circuitry. Acetylcholine spikes, the spotlight turns on, and your brain says, this is unfamiliar. I, I need to build some new circuits. Robert: Between entertainment and transformation. Theresa: Although I do think there's something good about trying to solve Wordo, even though you know how to play that, or do crossword puzzles, or things like that, at least keeps your mind active. Robert: Yeah, I like Wordo. Theresa: I do too. So, language learning is one example of a neuron builder, as we just said, but there are many other neuron builders, activities that reliably activate acetylcholine and support real change, and they're different for every person. Robert: Here are a few. Learning a new motor skill, such as knitting, tai chi, watercolor, typing with a new layout, learning a new sensory skill, photography, cooking with new spices, music training. Theresa: Oh, and you know all about the music training, right? Robert: I suffered through that long, long ago. Learning a new cognitive skill, a new software tool, a new route, a new planning method, learning a new relational skill, asking for help, setting boundaries, practicing micro-connection. Theresa: And, as I said, for some people, some of these are easy. For others of us, I mean, knitting, I remember when our first son was born, or before, I decided I would make a little afghan for him that was knitted, and it was just simple squares. Well, I had rectangles, squares, parallelograms, nothing was the same size, nothing the same shape, and, you know, but I watched people knit, and they make it look like it's the easiest thing ever. The common thread, though, with all these, they do require new maps, new patterns, and new attention. They wake up the spotlight. Robert: And they're all things you can do gently inside your wheel. Theresa: This is where gentle challenge becomes essential. It's the level where your brain says, this is new enough to matter, but safe. And safe is key. It's safe enough that I can stay open to it. Robert: Especially if you're living in a changed body. Pain, fatigue, injury, disability, chronic illness, trauma, aging. Your nervous system is more sensitive to threat. You can't push through. You can't just try harder. Theresa: And speaking of aging, I think, I know as I've gotten older, even not mentioning the vision loss, I have a stronger sense of self-preservation. I become a chicken in many ways. I don't take so many risks, especially with the vision loss, but I'm a chicken now. Which is totally different from what I was. I didn't really consider that in the past. So, you can still change. And your brain is still capable of learning. It just needs a different kind of input. Robert: So, let's talk about the Goldilocks zone. The level of challenge that's just right. Theresa: The Goldilocks zone is where the spotlight stays on. It's where acetylcholine says, strengthen this. It's where your brain can actually learn. Robert: Let's make this real with an example. Imagine someone recovering from spinal surgery. Too easy. Standing up once an hour, no spotlight. Too hard. Walking a mile, stress chemistry shuts everything down. The Goldilocks zone. Walking to the end of the driveway once a day. New, doable, safe, repeatable. Theresa: And when they repeat that small walk with tiny variations, their brain starts to rewire. It's not because they pushed harder, but because they stayed in the zone where learning is possible. Robert: Let's introduce the micro adaptation menu. Gentle starting points tailored to different kinds of disruptions. Theresa: Here are a few examples. Robert: The Goldilocks zone for mobility disruptions. Walk to the mailbox or the next room. Variation. Change the time or add one slow breath. Theresa: Fatigue based conditions. One three minute upright activity. A variation to this is add rest before and after. And if you have balance issues, the Goldilocks zone for you is to stand for 10 seconds with light support. A variation on that is to shift weight or turn your head slightly. Robert: Cognitive fog. Goldilocks zone. Read one paragraph or analyze one item. Variation. Change the time of day. Theresa: And for anxiety or trauma responses, think about doing for the getting in the Goldilocks zone, a 30 second presence exercise. And a variation of that could be adding grounding or increasing the duration by 10 seconds. Robert: Strength or deconditioning. The Goldilocks zone could be one sit to stand or lift a soup can five times. Variation could be add one repetition. Theresa: And again, I want to note, we are not professional medical people. We're not occupational therapists, physical therapists. We are podcasters. So before you do anything, be sure to consult with a medical professional to be sure these work for you. So here's the part that ties everything together. Your final objective is to change to autopilot. Robert: Not because autopilot is lazy, but because autopilot is efficient. It's the brain's way of saying, we've built this pathway. We can carry it on for you now. Theresa: Exactly. Acetylcholine helps you learn the new pattern. Gentle challenge keeps the spotlight on and keeps you from getting frustrated or injured. Repetition with variation strengthens the pathway. Eventually the behavior becomes automatic. Robert: Sustainable change. That's nervous system friendly change. That's change that doesn't require willpower or perfection. Theresa: And some of it maybe requires a little bit of willpower. I mean, if practice does make perfect or good enough, as Voltaire would say. So as you move through the workbook, and we're going to go over that in a few minutes, keep asking yourself, is this new enough to matter and safe enough to repeat? If your answer is yes, you're in the Godelak zone. Robert: That's where your brain does its best work. We'll walk with you through every step of it. Theresa: So let's talk about the workbook now. The workbook guides you and other people who are living in bodies that have changed later in life through illness, injury, chronic pain, disability, or even aging. And it helps you rebuild a life that fits your current reality. It rejects toxic positivity. And one reason for that is that would make me think nothing is worth doing. And since I'm the author of the book, I can reject toxic positivity. It instead offers grounded, compassionate, and sustainable practices. So the tone and philosophy is it's honest. It's non-performative. None of that, oh, just be grateful and our God only gives these burdens to people. Who can bear them? Or any of that other kind of inexcusable messaging. And it's written by someone who has lived through enough of these changes. I can say that at one point I couldn't walk. I still have digestive issues that control my life. And with the low vision, just seeing where those pills are that my life is based on is a bit of a challenge sometimes. The book also focuses on neuroplasticity, emotional regulation, and small doable shifts. It encourages curiosity instead of pressure. It honors grief. And honesty is important. Anybody who doesn't grieve about having these changes maybe should seek some other kind of help too. But it honors your grief, understands your capacity, and validates the truth of the lived experience. Robert: The book is based on 70 days. And if you remember from some of our previous podcasts, the 70 days is based in science. Some people said 66 days. 70 days is a nice round number. The days are arranged in groups. The first days, 1 through 14, is noticing what's true now. The focus is understanding what has changed, naming losses without judgment, identifying current capacity, beginning gentle daily reflection. And the tools you're going to use are the microjournaling, body awareness check-ins, and what's possible today prompts. Theresa: Then onward to days 15 to 28, you can start rebuilding internal safety. The focus there is grounding your nervous system, reducing overwhelm, creating emotional steadiness, and learning to pause without quitting. The tools you can use are breath-based resets, a five-minute return to center practices, and other prompts that build internal reassurance. Robert: These 29 to 42 are reimagining your identity. The focus is who you are now versus who you were. Untangling identity from productivity, reclaiming agency, pouring new self-definitions. And the tool for this, identity mapping, good statements, and values-based reflection. Theresa: As you progress on to days 43 to 46, and good for you for sticking with it, is rebuilding a life that fits. The focus there is designing routines that match your real capacity, and that is easier said than done. Re-entering life gently. Robert gets frustrated with me when I tried to lead the way or do what I used to do when I often traveled solo. It's one of those autopilot things, and I guess one thing is you need to turn some things off about autopilot, because now they can be dangerous. Other things you can do is testing small experiments, and that's really good if you're going on a longer trip. And I think we mentioned in an earlier podcast, you know, try do a day trip somewhere. See how that works. See how you can navigate the area you are in. Take notes of what didn't work so well, so you know for your longer trip what you need to change. And then you can replace the all-or-nothing thinking with one doable step, which I know for us that has been taking a rest and just saying we've done enough for the day. Because the more tired we get, the more likely we are to injure ourselves. So the tools for that would be habit scaffolding, energy-based planning that's extremely important. Don't wear yourself out. Later, we'll talk about the spoon theory. And then weekly micro experiments. Robert: You'll be using tools of future pacing, and swavel plans, and closing reflections. Theresa: And remember, weables wobble, but they never fall down. So what you should gain from going through the workbook, and we hope you gain this, it's a compassionate companion through a difficult transition. It's also a realistic sustainable way to rebuild your life after your body's changed. This daily structure is one that doesn't overwhelm. It gives you a sense of possibility rooted in truth and not pressure. And it's a new relationship with your body, identity, and future. So we have some show notes, again, that gives you some other prompts that you might want to consider. Other short exercises. There is, of course, a link to the workbook. We'd love to know your thoughts. And we will see you again next week. Thanks for listening to The Good Life. Show Notes

Music

Mentioned

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Change

Guided Immersion with ToursByLocals

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 23 Jun 2026 18:28:50 +0000

A Deep Dive Into South Beach

In this episode we share our experience with our wonderful guide, Ileana from ToursByLocals. It's an ideal way to learn more about South Beach. We delved into the Art Deco heritage of the town. Next time, we are there, we will be more observant noticing the small details of the Art Deco style. We usually stay in an Art Deco apartment and will look out for more details the next time that we visit South Beach

AS AN AMAZON ASSOCIATE I EARN FROM QUALIFYING PURCHASES.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Theresa: Welcome back to Living the Could Life, where we talk about real travel for real bodies. It's the kind of trips you can actually take, not the ones influencers pretend to float through and show their wonderful bodies and new outfits. We're not quite like that. Today, we are heading to South Beach, part of Miami, that's in Florida, but it's not the version you get from a brochure. We're talking about exploring it with tours by locals and why having a local guide can completely change your experience. Robert: And we're not just talking about someone who knows the area. We mean people who live the culture, understand the history, and can point out the tiny details you'd walk right past, especially on an architectural tour, which is one of the most underrated ways to understand this part of Miami. Theresa: And that is so important. I've taken other tours. I was actually on a tour from a cruise ship where the guy just said: “On the left is the ocean,on the right are the mountains.” This advice applies to other tour companies or touring guides as well. Back to South Beach. It's one of the places where you can really get along on your own. You can walk. It's very walkable. You can take the free trolley. You can take a bus. There's Uber and other shared ride services. But to really get a good look at the area, it helps to have a guide or to have done a significant amount of research. So when you go on your own, it's likely you might miss 80% of the local interesting architecture, the local facts about South Beach. A lot of people there, they go just to go swimming, go to the beach, sunbathe, hang out, eat, drink, and party. With the local guide, you get the stories behind all the neon, the Art Deco, the families who've owned and operated restaurants and hotels for years, and the preservation battles behind the Art Deco district. Robert: And let's be honest, South Beach can be overwhelming. Crowds, heat, parking, noise. A local guide cuts through all that. They know the shady spots to stand in, the quiet corners, the clean bathrooms, the places where you can actually hear yourself think. Theresa: And that was definitely good for us, especially for me. When I don't see well, it was nice to know where I can go find a restroom or find a place in the shade. And this is another good reason to hire an independent, private tour guide. So something very important is tours by locals. That's their guides. You're not just getting some random person who watched a YouTube video or an influencer Instagram to tell you about South Beach. Our guide was licensed, experienced, and the guides build their own itineraries. So we took an architectural tour, which was sponsored by Tours by Locals for us, so that we could share it with you. So the first thing to do is head to toursbylocals.com and search South Beach or whichever area you're visiting, because Tours by Locals is in many different cities. In fact, we are planning a trip to Italy and we wanted to check out some castles and it's not easy to get to by bus or transportation. So Tours by Locals was an option for us, although we found in the end, because of our castle itinerary, it was just easier for us who sometimes go off on tangents, not only on this podcast, but when researching and we decided, oh, we should just rent a car for that day, which was frightening, and it still could be frightening, but we're in a rural area, so there's no Ferraris on the highways running you off a cliff or anything like that. So we look for a private guide. Some are very good. For many of them, you can create a custom tour for yourself. But sometimes, you know, we don't want to be with somebody when we argue and complain about the driver and our backseat drivers and things like that. We have a specific object. So in that case, we should reconsider. But we did see some excellent walking tours in the town and this is in Bergamo. They look really interesting and I will say by looking at Tours by Locals, and maybe this is kind of not what they really want you to do, but you can get an idea of highlights of a town, and walk it or explore it on your own, especially if you know you're only going to have like 10 minutes here or 20 minutes there. So it's always up to you. But back to our South Beach experience and how to find a tour by Tours by Locals and Robert's going to explain that. Robert: Let's walk through the booking process because this is where people get stuck. Step one, browse the tour. Go to Tours by Locals and search South Beach or Miami Beach. And you'll see everything from food tours to Cuban heritage tours to deep dives, architecture walks. Step two, read the guide profile. This is the gold. You'll see their background, languages, specialties, reviews, photos of past tours, their personal philosophy on guiding. Theresa: And don't skip the reviews. I mean, it's nice to match yourself with somebody who has the same philosophy or pace or interest as you do. So, you know, look for patterns and, you know, look for specific patterns. Sometimes somebody says, oh yeah, great guide or it was a good tour. You know, maybe you should read between the lines. It is not just ToursbByLLocals. It's for hotels, resorts, restaurants, and a lot of you probably already know that. So you can really sniff out what's a good tour. So look for things like saying they really knew how to pace the walk. And when you book them, you can request a slow tour. You can request lots of bathroom breaks. You can request anything you want. It's your private tour guide. There are some who specifically will adapt to people with mobility needs or keep us out of the sun or we can't walk up a lot of stairs. And of course, you need to know what is their background. Many have degrees in art history or they're on historical committees and they're active in the community. So it's nice to have somebody who really knows about what you're interested in and you can tell them how deeply you'd like to go into the topic. The next step then, and it goes with what I was just talking about, is ask questions. How much walking is involved? Are you going to walk three miles? Are you going to just walk a few blocks or can you walk a block and take a rest? How difficult is the terrain? Can you focus on architecture or less on architecture, more about the history of each building or the design or its past? Are there accessibility considerations, as we just mentioned? And what time of the day is best for the heat, the crowds, the cold, the sun? Whatever is important to you. And then step four is once you find somebody and you can email back and forth, you know, be sure you're comfortable with the person and maybe choose a top three in whatever you want to do. If you're interested in food, what's their background? Are they a chef? Do they review restaurants? Are they a specialist cook in a certain cuisine? So once you figure that all out, you get a confirmation and a thread of what you message with your guide. And from there you can start fine-tuning the plan. And also be sure you know about confirmations, cancellations, reservations, everything like that. Be very specific and don't be afraid to ask questions. Robert: Preparation is where a good tour becomes a great one. Here's what to do before you go. Check the weather. South Beach humidity is not subtle. Wear breathable clothing. Bring water, even on a short tour. Ask about shade break. Guides usually plan them but confirm. Tell your guide your mobility needs. They will adjust the route. Screenshot the meeting point. Self-service can be spotty near the beach. Theresa: If you're doing an architectural tour and have a strong interest, you might want to bring a small notebook or use the notes on your phone just so you remember the building names. You can number the buildings as you take photos or do whatever you want because you may want to come back later and explore more in depth. In addition to that, you can remember the building names, the architects, the stories that make the district come alive, and the little details on the building. Why is taking a tour with a guide from Tourist by Locals? Why is it worth it? So let's talk especially about architecture since that's the tour that we did. South Beach is really an open-air museum of architecture with Art Deco, Streamline, Modern, Mediterranean Revival. Robert: A local guide will point out things you'd never notice. The pastel color palette chosen after the 1926 hurricane. The porthole windows and ship-inspired railing. The terrazzo floors that survived decades of storm. The neon signage rules that keep the district historically consistent. Theresa: And stories about it. Why did they use concrete? What kind of preservation fights were there in the 70s? Remember urban renewal and the like when they wanted to just tear every building down and replace it with something new? Who were designers who shaped that skyline? Which buildings almost didn't survive? You get context along with the pretty facades of the buildings and the interiors as well. Our guide took us inside several buildings not only to use the restrooms or to grab a drink but also to see what the interiors looked like. Robert: Plus the guides know which buildings you can actually go inside and which ones have interesting features inside. Some of the lobbies are just absolutely jaw-dropping. Theresa: And that was really important if we had just stayed on the outside. We could admire the architecture but we would never have considered just walking into a hotel to look at a fireplace or mural or stained glass or anything like that. And if you really further want to enjoy, come back later, stop in for a lunch or breakfast or drink. So now during the tour with Tours by Locos, what should you expect? First, expect a pace that matches your group. I mean this is a private group so really you can let your guide know what pace you want. You don't have to feel like you're too slow to keep up with other people as you would in a large group tour. So that's also a real advantage of having your own private guide. And they are really great about adjusting and that's another question to ask up front. And they can be slower, faster, take more breaks, add more stories, add fewer stories, and just learn about you as well. Robert: And you can expect real conversation. These aren't scripted tours. You could ask questions, request detours, or say, hey can we stop for a cafecito? And they'll know exactly where to go. Theresa: Yes and our guide was great about that and she is of Cuban heritage and I can't remember what we were discussing. I said that Robert came over on the boat because Robert did come over on the boat. Well in Miami that has a different meaning. She asked him if he were Cuban. He came on the boat from somewhere in Germany. Robert: From Germany? No I was two years old. Theresa: Well anyway so he's not Cuban and actually when we went to Cuba they didn't want to let him in nor did they want to let him out. So but anyway it was interesting to talk about her life and her experience. She has many interests. So they're definitely not scripted tours or conversations. You can learn things that you can repeat to your friends or recommend when they go to South Beach. It's a mark of a really good tour. Robert: After the tour take five minutes to jot down what stood out. This helps if you're building a trip report, writing a review, or planning future episodes like we do. Theresa: Then leave a thoughtful review. Mention specifics. How was the pacing, the accessibility, the storytelling, your comfort with the guide, the guide's knowledge. It helps future travelers know what to expect and it also helps the guide. Robert: And if you love the experience ask the guide for recommendations for the rest of your trip. Locals know the good spots. Theresa: Right for example our guide took us to a rooftop bar and pool of a hotel where we could overlook the ocean and most of the town. South Beach is beautiful on its own but with a local tour guide it's a story in itself and you become part of it as opposed to an observer. Robert: If you're planning a trip consider booking through Tours by Locals. It's one of the easiest ways to turn a hot crowded beach day into something meaningful memorable and actually enjoyable. Theresa: And before we say goodbye let's go and talk about a checklist that we made that will be added to the show notes. You can use this for booking your hosted guide, for booking your guide, for booking your Tours by Locals guide, or really I mean this is kind of a universal checklist so you could use it for any type of guide you want to book. So first before you book browse Tours by Locals for in this case South Beach, Miami Beach, or wherever you are going. Then filter out the tour type. It could be architecture, culture, food, history, maybe even castles. And go as we mentioned before read the guide profile see what the background is see what their specialty are see what their languages are especially when you go to a country that does not speak English there are some like I looked at one well they speak Russian and maybe they spoke English as well but be sure to check to be sure. Scan the reviews for the pacing, accessibility, and storytelling. Check the tour duration and the walking distance and it seemed like more of these were many are walking tours but there are some where you drive and you can have an entire day like seven hours visiting the local area. Confirm the price, the group size, and what's included and you can tell them if you want it to be a private tour. And then shortlist two or three of the guides that seem appealing. Robert: Then message the guide. Send a quick message asking how much walking is involved. Can we focus more on architecture? Are there shade breaks built in? Any accessibility consideration? What time of day is best for heat or avoiding crowd? Where exactly is the meeting point? And any other concerns you may have. Theresa: Right and we have gone over most lists before but this is like your handy one page one and a half page information sheet. So finalize the date and time. Add the confirmation to your calendar. If you are traveling abroad where there's a significant time change be sure you have the correct date. Ask for a screenshot of the meeting point and how to contact the guide. If you don't have the guide's phone number it may be difficult to get in touch with them quickly. Share what your mobility or pacing needs are. Are you bringing any kind of mobility equipment? Ask about backup plans for the weather. And request any kind of customization like an emphasis on a certain topic. A slower pace or photoshop since South Beach was very good for photo staffs. Robert: Then prep for the day. Check the weather and humidity. Wear breathable clothing. Comfortable walking shoes. Bring water. Bring a sunscreen and hat. Portable fan optional but helpful if it's really warm. A small notebook or phone app for notes for architectural details. Fully charged phone. And make sure you have cash or card for incidentals, cafe stops, or tips. Theresa: During the tour confirm the pacing at the start again and people learn after you repeat something I think seven times. So ask questions freely. Don't hesitate. It's your tour and that is if you've booked a private tour. But you can still ask other questions. But I think one benefit especially for people who have disruptive bodies is that it is your tour not a group tour. Request shade or rest breaks as you need them. Take note of the building names, the architects, and the stories. And take photos of the details like the tiles, the signage, the motifs, even the structur And ask for local recommendations for from your tour guide for later. Robert: And after the tour jot down highlights while they're fresh. Say building names or locations that you want to revisit. Leave a thoughtful review. Mention pacing, accessibility, storytelling. Bookmark the guide for future trips. Add notes to your travel journal or trip report. Theresa: We'll drop the checklist into the show notes along with information for tours by locals. You'll be pleased that they are in so many different cities around the world. And using that you can prep yourself for your own tour. And we do want to announce that our workbook is now in print and we're going to talk about that next time. Go over it a little bit. So until then, keep living the good life. See you next week. Show Notes

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Mentioned

ToursByLocals South Beach, Miami

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Change

Your free checklist for finding a guide who understands your wants and needs.

The Boat Company Saves the Tongass

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 16 Jun 2026 17:55:58 +0000

Part 2: The Science Behind the Tongass and Why The Boat Company Wants to Preserve the Forest

In this episode we share a deeper dive into the Science of The Tongass National Forest. We have combined several bits of research, interviews and personal experience into two Notebook-generated conversations. The convo not only shows the advantages of sailing with The Boat Company, but also delves into the science that illustrates exactly why The Boat Company continues its committed to preserving this large expanse of inimitable space.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Speaker 2: So, I want you to imagine that you are sitting on this incredibly green, mossy log in absolute silence. Speaker 2: Just totally off the grid. Speaker 2: Exactly. You are miles from cell service and you think, ah, I have completely escaped the global economy. I'm finally out of it. Speaker 1: Yeah, you feel totally isolated from all of that. Speaker 2: Right. But you are actually sitting right on top of a highly aggressive $2.2 billion commodities market. Speaker 1: Oh, wow. That is quite the visual. Speaker 2: Isn't it? So, welcome to our deep dive into the Tongass National Forest in Southeast Alaska. Speaker 1: It's an incredible topic and I'm really excited to get into the sources we have today. Speaker 2: Same here. But before we get into the hidden mechanics of what is happening under that moss, I really want you to try and picture the sheer scale of this place. Because, I mean, when I hear the word forest, my brain usually defaults to a nice, manageable state park. Speaker 1: Right. Like maybe some paved trails, a little visitor center. Speaker 2: Yeah, a place you can drive across in an hour, buy a postcard and go home. But the Tongass is over 16 million acres. Speaker 1: Which is, I mean, to put 16 million acres into a frame of reference that the human brain can actually process, you are looking at a landmass that covers roughly 80% of all of Southeast Alaska. Speaker 2: 80%? Speaker 1: Yeah. It is the largest national forest in the United States by a massive margin. But it is not just, you know, a monolithic block of pine trees sitting on a flat plain. The geography is completely splintered. Speaker 2: Splintered is a great way to put it. Speaker 1: Right. Because we are talking about an archipelago of over 1,000 individual islands and they're separated by these incredibly deep, dark saltwater fjords. Speaker 2: It's just wild. Speaker 1: And you have massive ancient glaciers carving their way down mountainsides directly into the ocean. The ocean literally weaves right into the heart of the timber. And crucially, this is a temperate rainforest. Speaker 2: Yeah. And that distinction changes everything about how the ecosystem functions. Because I think people hear the word rainforest and they automatically picture, you know, the Amazon or the Congo Basin. Speaker 1: Right. The tropics, sweltering heat, the jumble vibes. Speaker 2: Exactly. But temperate rainforests operate on entirely different biological rules and they are incredibly scarce. I mean, they make up only about 2.5% of the world's total forest coverage. Speaker 1: It's a tiny fraction. Speaker 2: It really is. And the Tongass happens to be one of the only temperate rainforests left on Earth that still remains largely intact and functioning just as it did thousands of years ago. Speaker 1: Okay, let's unpack this. Because we have an incredible stack of source material to get through today. Speaker 2: We really do. Tons of ground to cover. Speaker 1: And the goal here is to merge two wildly different realities presented in these sources. The first reality is the boots-on-the-ground, visceral, deeply human experience of actually standing in that untouched wilderness. Speaker 2: The subjective experience of it. Speaker 1: Exactly. We have firsthand accounts, interviews with captains and conservationists, and stories of people trying to navigate a landscape that actively resists human infrastructure. Speaker 2: It does not want us there. Speaker 1: No, it doesn't. And then the second reality is the uncompromising, high-stakes physics of global carbon cycles, climate buffering, and the incredibly intense federal policy battles over whether to log this land or just leave it alone. Speaker 2: Right. And I feel like the connective tissue between those two realities is how you actually get into the forest to see it in the first place. Speaker 1: Because you can't just rent a car. Speaker 2: No. You cannot just rent a car and drive through the Tongass. Yeah. There's almost no road system connecting these islands. The landscape completely forbids it. So to understand this place, you have to get on the water. Speaker 1: You have to take a boat. Speaker 2: You do. And that brings us to the primary vehicle for our exploration today, which is an organization called The Boat Company. Speaker 1: Yeah. This is such an interesting part of the source material. Speaker 2: It really is. Speaker 1: Yeah. Speaker 2: Because when you start digging into the origin story of this specific ecotourism nonprofit, you uncover an absolute collision of American corporate history and modern environmental conservation. It is, frankly, the strangest family tree you could possibly imagine for an environmental group. Speaker 1: The lineage is completely unexpected. So Hunter McIntosh is the current owner and operator of The Boat Company. And when you trace his family history, it doesn't lead back to, you know, a rugged Alaskan fur trapper. Speaker 2: Or some early 19th century naturalist writing poetry in the woods. Speaker 1: No. Not at all. His great-great-grandfather was actually one of the founding figures of the great Atlantic and Pacific Tea Company. Speaker 2: A&P. The grocery titan. Speaker 1: The very same. Speaker 2: I mean, for anyone who didn't grow up in the era when A&P dominated, it is really hard to overstate just how massive they were. Speaker 1: Oh, they were behemoth. Speaker 2: Yeah. Before Walmart, before massive digital supply chains and barcode scanners, A&P was the undisputed king of the American retail landscape. They essentially invented the modern grocery shopping experience. Speaker 1: Didn't they pioneer those loyalty programs, too? Speaker 2: They did. They pioneered things like S&H green stamps, which was a total cultural phenomenon. Like, you would buy your groceries, the cashier would hand you these physical little green stamps, and you would go home, literally lick them, and stick them into a booklet. Speaker 1: Oh, man. I remember hearing about those. Speaker 2: Yeah. And once you filled enough booklets, you could trade them in for a toaster or a lawnmower or a set of dishes from a catalog. It was the original loyalty program, and it built a generation-defining corporate empire. Speaker 1: So it was a fortune built entirely on high-volume, industrialized commerce. Exactly. But the bridge between that massive grocery empire and the remote Alaskan wilderness was Hunter's father, Mike McIntosh. So in the late 1940s and early 1950s, when Mike was just 18 or 19 years old, he traveled up to Alaska to work. Speaker 2: And he didn't go work for an environmental group, right? Speaker 1: No. He worked for an A&P subsidiary known as the Waterfall Cannery. Speaker 2: Which was a massive operation. Speaker 1: It was the largest salmon fishing fleet and canning operation in the entire state of Alaska at the time. And it existed for one single purpose. It was the sole exclusive provider of canned salmon for every single A&P grocery store across the nation. Speaker 2: So young Mike McIntosh is out there working the fishing boats, smelling the diesel and the salt, working the loud mechanized cannery lines, and he just falls profoundly in love with the Alaskan ecosystem. Speaker 1: It totally captivates him. Speaker 2: Yeah. The imposing scale of the water and the timber just gets under his skin in a way that alters the trajectory of his entire life. Speaker 1: But that visceral connection laid dormant for a few decades while he built his life. Fast forward to the late 1970s and the family inheritance is being managed and distributed. Speaker 2: Right. The A&P fortune. Speaker 1: Exactly. And in most families possessing that level of generational wealth, the standard procedure is entirely predictable. You divide the assets into private trusts, you split it among the siblings, you buy some real estate and everyone just goes their separate ways. Speaker 2: Sure. That's what you expect. And Mike's siblings did go off to pursue other interests. You know, aviation, farming, equestrian pursuits. But the family made a collective decision to create a foundation. Speaker 1: Which is a huge pivot. Speaker 2: It is. Mike took the reins of this newly formed foundation and instead of just funneling money into traditional philanthropic avenues, he focused it squarely on social justice and environmental protection. Speaker 1: And he took an incredibly hands-on approach. Like in 1979, Mike and his wife organized an expedition to Southeast Alaska. Speaker 2: But he didn't just invite a bunch of wealthy friends for a vacation. Speaker 1: Oh, not at all. He brought the absolute heavyweights of the early environmental movement. I mean, the guest list on that trip reads like a roster of conservation titans. It was on it. He brought John and Patricia Adams from the Natural Resources Defense Council, the NRDC. He brought Rick Sutherland, who was the founder of the organization we now know as Earth Justice. He had major representatives from the Sierra Club and the Ford Foundation. Speaker 2: That is quite the boat ride. Speaker 1: Right. And Mike's philosophy was simple, but really profound. He understood that these lawyers and activists were fighting brutal battles in courtrooms in Washington, D.C. to protect landscapes they had never actually seen. Speaker 2: Ah, that makes so much sense. Speaker 1: He knew he needed them to physically feel the scale and the fragility of the Tongass firsthand. Speaker 2: And the story takes this amazing turn at the end of that expedition. So they have spent a few weeks in the wilderness, and one of these major conservation leaders turns to Mike McIntosh, a man who, again, is managing a grocery fortune and has absolutely zero experience in hospitality or running a commercial maritime tourism business, and tells him, Mike, you need to start a boat business. Speaker 1: Just out of nowhere. Speaker 2: Right. And the logic driving that request was actually entirely pragmatic. The environmental groups realized they had a massive fundraising problem. They needed a way to bring their major donors up to the Tongass to show them exactly what their donations were protecting. Speaker 1: Because you can't just hand a wealthy donor a brochure and expect a massive check to save a forest they don't understand. Speaker 2: Exactly. They needed a platform for total immersion. And Mike simply agrees. He commits to the idea. In 1980, he goes out into the maritime market and buys a boat. It was a motor vessel called the Observer. Speaker 1: And this is where it gets crazy. Speaker 2: I cannot get over the staggering irony of this specific purchase. The vessel Mike McIntosh bought to launch this conservation-focused ecotourism nonprofit was previously owned and operated by Standard Oil. Speaker 1: Unbelievable. Speaker 2: Right. It was literally a vessel used by a massive fossil fuel monopoly to navigate the San Francisco Bay, taking executives out to look at industrial operations. Speaker 1: What's fascinating here is how clearly this demonstrates a real world, highly functional approach to conservation. Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not exactly pure, is it? Speaker 1: No. And the environmental movement is often criticized for demanding absolute ideological purity. If Mike had been obsessed with purity, he would have spent years trying to commission, I don't know, a custom sailboat made from reclaimed fallen timber powered by wind and good intentions. Speaker 2: Which wouldn't have worked up there. Speaker 1: Exactly. He needed utility. He needed a heavy, sturdy, capable steel vessel that could survive the rugged tidal currents of Alaska. So he took a tool forged by heavy industry, a tool of fossil fuel extraction, and repurposed it for preservation. Speaker 2: It is brilliant leverage. I mean, you take a fortune built on a grocery monopoly, use a boat built by an oil monopoly, and use them both to save a forest. Speaker 1: It's amazing. So they refit the observer, made the interior a bit more hospitable, and started bringing people up. Speaker 2: And initially, it was just these highly curated trips for major donors of the NRDC and the Sierra Club. But the operation proved so successful at changing minds that they eventually realized they needed to open the doors to everyday citizens. Speaker 1: Makes sense. Speaker 2: Yeah. Today, the boat company operates two small vessels, the Lizaron and the Mist Cove. They are very intimate settings, holding only about 20 to 24 guests each. But once you have the boats and you have the guests, how do you actually run the trip? Because if you look at the broader context of Alaskan tourism, it is completely dominated by massive, rigid infrastructure. Speaker 1: Oh, the contrast is extreme. I mean, the standard Alaskan cruise experience involves what are essentially floating cities. Speaker 2: Right, the megaships. Speaker 1: Yeah. Megaships carrying three, four, or 5,000 passengers. These ships operate on timetables that are calculated down to the minute. They have strict port calls, scheduled theater performances, assigned dining times. It's a highly curated, deeply managed experience of the landscape. Speaker 2: You are basically experiencing the wilderness through a pane of glass on a very tight schedule. Speaker 1: Exactly. But in the interview with Captain Jim, who pilots the Mist Cove, he outlines a philosophy that completely dismantles that expectation. Speaker 2: He really does. It requires a total reset of the guest's brain. When the interviewer asked him for a typical itinerary, his answer was incredibly blunt. He basically said, we don't have an itinerary. Speaker 1: Which is wild for a commercial trip. Speaker 2: If you are a traveler who is used to controlling every single variable of your vacation, paying thousands of dollars for a trip where the captain openly admits he has no idea where you are going on Tuesday must sound terrifying. Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd probably panic a little at first. But Captain Jim's parameters are actually incredibly simple. He knows what day the ship leaves the dock in Juneau or Sitka on a Sunday. And he knows what day they absolutely must return to disembark the following Saturday. Right. Every single hour in between those two points is completely fluid. The entire journey is dictated by three unpredictable variables, the wind, the tides and the wildlife. Speaker 2: And that is the defining characteristic of true expedition travel. Adapting to Mother Nature isn't viewed as a disruption of their vacation plan. Adapting to Mother Nature is the plan. Like if the wind picks up and the water gets dangerously choppy in a specific strait they intended to cross, they don't try to force their massive steel hull through the waves just to make a scheduled port call and keep a dinner reservation. Speaker 1: No, they pivot immediately. They look at the charts, find a secretive sheltered inlet like North Dot Inlet or Tats Bay, drop anchor and just explore whatever is right in front of them. Speaker 2: And the weather itself is a massive component of this required mental reset because the Tongass is a temperate rainforest and the operative word there is rain. Speaker 1: Oh yeah. Lots of it. Speaker 2: Captain Jim explicitly tells guests that in the Tongass, rain is not an inconvenience. It is a verb. It is an active participant in your day. Speaker 1: I mean, the town of Ketchikan, located in the southern part of the region, receives over 200 inches of rain annually. Speaker 2: 200 inches? Speaker 1: Yeah. It rains almost every single day in some capacity. Speaker 2: So if you try to hide from the rain in the Tongass, you are going to spend your entire week sitting in the ship's lounge looking out a foggy window. Speaker 1: Which totally defeats the purpose. Speaker 2: Right. The instruction to the guests is uncompromising. Put on your heavy rubber boots, zip up your waterproof gear and accept the wet. Because the rain is the engine of the entire ecosystem. It is the lifeblood that waters the giant Sitka spruce and western hemlock trees. It fills the streams for the salmon. Speaker 1: And once the guests embrace that reality, the daily activities sound incredibly rich. Because the ship only holds two dozen people, the days unfold very gently. Speaker 2: What do they actually do all day? Speaker 1: Well, you might spend the morning kayaking in completely glassy, silent water. Or you might take a skiff to a rugged shore and hike through an old growth area on the Brothers Islands. The guests affectionately call one specific area Fern Gully because the ground, the rocks and every branch of the trees are completely draped in a thick, spongy, ancient green moss. Speaker 2: That sounds beautiful. Speaker 1: And then there is the fishing, which is a massive draw. The interview notes indicate that almost a majority of the passengers sign up to fish whenever the opportunity arises, regardless of their prior experience level. Speaker 2: Oh, really? Even people who have never fished before? Speaker 1: Yeah. And the crew facilitates incredibly diverse fishing experiences. They take motorized skiffs out into the deep saltwater fjords to target massive halibut and rockfish. Speaker 2: Nice. Speaker 1: Some guests are so successful they have their catch flash frozen and shipped back home to the lower 48, or they just hand it over to the ship's chef who prepares it fresh for dinner that exact same night. Speaker 2: See that sounds amazing, but the freshwater fishing sounds like an entirely different level of immersion. Speaker 1: Oh, absolutely. Speaker 2: According to the sources, the crew provides you with heavy, waterproof waders. You take a skiff to the shoreline, hike inland through the dense brush, and you physically step right into the freezing clear, fast-moving streams to cast for salmon or trout. You are standing thigh-deep inside the biological arteries of the forest. Speaker 1: That is just incredible. And the sensory details from the audio sources are stunning, too. There is a description of taking a small skiff deep into a fjord to view Dawes Glacier. Speaker 2: Oh, right. The glacier calving. Speaker 1: Yeah. You aren't just looking at it from miles away. The skiff has to physically weave and dodge through a minefield of floating icebergs just to get close to the face of the glacier. Wow. And the visual descriptions of the Glacial S are striking. The sources talk about sections of the glacier that look exactly like stained-glass blue windows right before the pressure causes them to fracture. Speaker 2: That must be surreal to see in person. Speaker 1: Seriously. The physical experience of sitting in a tiny skiff, waiting in the freezing mist, watching a towering wall of ice that is hundreds of feet tall, and anticipating the moment a building-sized chunk of crystal-clear or dense white ice cracks off and plunges into the water. The calving process. It must be a profound recalibration of the human senses. Speaker 2: I can't even imagine the sound of that. Speaker 1: Right. You are forced to notice the way the clouds curl around a specific mountain peak, or the exact acoustic crack of the ice echoing off the rock walls. Speaker 2: It's a beautiful picture, but I want to stop and look at the structural reality of accessing this environment, because getting out into that rugged landscape presents a very real physical challenge, particularly regarding accessibility for travelers with disabilities. Speaker 1: This is a really important point. Speaker 2: Yeah. The interviewer in our source material actually has low vision and uses walking sticks to navigate, so she brought this issue up directly with Hunter McIntosh. And the structural barrier begins with the boats themselves, because the boat company operates commercial marine vessels, and as such, they are strictly bound by Coast Guard SOLA's regulations. Speaker 1: Right. And SOLA stands for Safety of Life at Sea. It is a comprehensive, non-negotiable international maritime treaty. It dictates the fundamental safety architecture, engineering, and emergency protocols of all commercial ships. Speaker 2: So what does that mean for accessibility? Speaker 1: Well, one of the most rigid requirements of SOLAs is the mandatory presence of high, water-tight bulkheads on the doors and thresholds throughout the lower decks of the vessel. Speaker 2: Let me make sure I understand the physics of that. If the hull of the ship is breached by a rock or a submerged log, these bulkheads are basically the raised steel lips at the bottom of a doorway that allow you to seal a heavy steel door shut, right? Speaker 1: Exactly. They prevent catastrophic flooding from spreading from one compartment to the next. You basically sacrifice a hallway to save the ship. Speaker 2: Got it. Speaker 1: They are life-saving architectural necessities. But those very same bulkheads create an immediate, insurmountable accessibility barrier. You cannot easily roll a wheelchair over a 6-inch or 8-inch raised steel threshold. Speaker 2: Right. That would be incredibly difficult. Speaker 1: So because of these maritime safety laws, the ships are physically incapable of meeting strict ADA Americans with Disabilities Act architectural compliance. A wheelchair user would find it nearly impossible to board the vessel, navigate the narrow interior corridors, or access the bathrooms independently. Speaker 2: So if the architecture of the ship is legally fixed and inherently exclusionary, how does the company actually accommodate guests with mobility issues or visual impairments? Because the interviewer asked Hunter McIntosh if his crew undergoes specialized formal disability compliance training to handle these challenges. Speaker 1: And his answer was remarkably candid. Speaker 2: It really was. He explicitly stated that they do not run formal disability training seminars. Instead, he said his entire philosophy is focused intensely on hiring, quote, good human beings. Speaker 1: Now, on the surface, that sounds a bit evasive. It sounds like corporate speak for, we don't have a policy. But when the interviewer details how that philosophy actually plays out on the deck of the ship, you realize it is a deeply intentional, highly effective approach to hospitality. They are actively compensating for an architectural lack with an overabundance of human awareness, patience, and direct physical assistance. Speaker 2: Yeah, the interviewer detailed exactly what that looks like in practice. She noted that whenever she's trying to get in or out of the wobbly motorized skiffs, which, by the way, is difficult even with perfect vision and balance, she is always greeted with what the crew calls the sailor's handshake. Speaker 1: I love that detail. Speaker 2: It's so good. The crew members don't hover over her nervously. They don't awkwardly grab her arms or try to lift her. And they certainly don't rush her. They simply slow down the entire boarding process, assess her footing, lock forearms in a firm, steady grip, and physically bridge the gap between the swaying dock and the moving boat. Speaker 1: And they implement practical, logistical adaptations wherever possible without making a spectacle of it. For guests who use CPAP machines to manage sleep apnea, the crew ensures there is an abundant supply of distilled water waiting in the cabin. Speaker 2: Which they make right on the ship, right? Speaker 1: Yeah, it's generated on board by the ship's water makers. And for older guests who use folding walkers and can manage to step over the thresholds with a little assistance, the crew strategically assigns them cabins on the main deck. This avoids the steep, narrow internal staircases entirely and places them immediately adjacent to walk-in showers. Speaker 2: It's just very thoughtful. But the moment that really solidified this entire philosophy for me was the deeply personal story the interviewer shared about trying to hike the Moss Gully Trail on the Brothers Islands. Speaker 1: Oh, the story's so good. Speaker 2: It really is. So this is that beautiful, ancient area covered in thick moss we mentioned earlier. And because she has low vision and lacks depth perception, the terrain quickly became dangerous for her. There were hidden roots, slick, fallen logs, uneven ground, and the flat lighting under the canopy meant she simply couldn't tell if the path was sloping up or dropping off. Speaker 1: That sounds really disorienting. Speaker 2: Yeah, and recognizing her physical limits, she just stopped walking on the trail. Speaker 1: Now, in almost any standard group tour dynamic, a guest stopping unexpectedly creates immediate friction. The guest feels like a burden, holding everyone back. The guide feels immense pressure to rush the guest along to keep the group on their rigid schedule, or awkwardly tries to force them to complete a hike they aren't comfortable with. Speaker 2: But remember the anti-schedule. There is no rigid itinerary, which means there is no rush. Instead of pressuring her, a young crew member named Andrew simply stopped with her. He told the rest of the group to hike on ahead and enjoy the trail. And Andrew just sat down right next to her on a damp, mossy log. Speaker 1: And they didn't just sit there in awkward silence, waiting for the group to return. Speaker 2: Not at all. They spent the time talking about their lives, sharing stories, solving the problems of the world, completely surrounded by the dense quiet of the ancient forest. She told the interviewer that sitting on that wet moss with Andrew felt as safe and comfortable as sitting on her own living room couch. Speaker 1: It is a really moving anecdote because it offers such a profound lesson in environmental hospitality. By completely removing the anxiety of the environment, by offering genuine human patience and companionship rather than architectural solutions, Andrew bridged the gap. Speaker 2: You really did. Speaker 1: He didn't try to force her to conquer the trail. He allowed her to experience the magnitude of the Tongass exactly where she was, on her own terms. Transcribed by TurboScribe. Show Notes

Music

Mentioned

The Boat Company

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Disruption

NB: There are always enough guides to compensate for changes. The mossy forest hike had two guides - Andrew and Rachel. Guests are always supervised on excursions.

When you listen to this, remember that Robert and Theresa are the "interviewers".

Deeper Diving Into The Tongass

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 09 Jun 2026 16:32:23 +0000

Part 1: What We Learned Cruising With The Boat Company

In this episode we share a deeper dive into the Tongass Naational Forest. We have combined several bits of research, interviews and personal experience into twoNotebook generated conversations. The convo not only shows the advantages of sailing with The Boat Company, but also delves into the science that illustrates exactly why The Boat Company continues its committed to preserving this large expanse of inimitable space.

Transcript

Music

Mentioned

The Boat Company

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Disruption

NB: There are always enough guides to compensate for changes. The mossy forest hike had two guides - Andrew and Rachel. Guests are always supervised on excursions.

When you listen to this, remember that Robert and Theresa are the "interviewers".

Alaska Cruising With The Boat Company

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 02 Jun 2026 16:12:55 +0000

In this episode we share details about a recent cruise to Alaska. The Boat Company is a non-profit cruise line that has been plying the waters in SE Alaska for decades. Is this cruise line appropriate for those of us with body disruptions? Listen to find out.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Theresa: Some places don't need to be sold, they just need to be shown. Southeast Alaska is one of those places. It's a world of mist, mountains, and water that feels untouched, almost ancient. Robert: And tucked inside that world is the Boat Company, a small non-profit that's been quietly, steadily protecting this landscape for more than 40 years. They don't advertise loudly, they don't chase trends, they simply invite people into a place they love and use travel to help save it. Theresa: Today, we're talking about small ship cruising in Alaska with the Boat Company. Unlike other cruise lines you've heard of, they operate two small vessels, the Leesorone and the Mist Cove, each carrying just 20 to 24 guests. We sailed on Mist Cove. It's intimate, personal, and deeply connected to the land and water around it. Robert: And their mission centers on one of the most extraordinary ecosystems on Earth, the Tongass National Forest. Theresa: And because so many travelers don't realize what the Tongass actually is, and some have never really heard about it, we want to pause here and give it the space it deserves. Welcome to Living the Good Life. I'm Theresa. Robert: And I'm your co-host, Robert. So let's get into it. The Tongass National Forest is the largest national forest in the United States. Nearly 17 million acres of islands, fjords, mountains, glaciers, and old-growth rainforest. It covers almost 80% of southeast Alaska and forms the U.S. portion of the largest temperate rainforest left on Earth. Theresa: Like Alaska, this is a giant forest. Almost everything in Alaska is much bigger than you expect, or at least it was far bigger than I ever expected. This is the forest of giants like the ancient Sitka Spruce, Western Hemlock, and Cedar. They have stood for hundreds, sometimes more than a thousand years. It's the old-growth forest at its best. These trees rise like pillars in a green cathedral, draped in moss and rooted in tongue. Robert: Beneath those trees runs water. Cold, clear, life-giving water. 19,000 miles of salmon streams braid through the Tongass. All five species of Pacific salmon spawn here, feeding bears, eagles, wolves, communities, and entire regional economies. Theresa: You can't go to Alaska without trying salmon. Wildlife thrives here in ways that feel almost mythical. Brown and black bears, the rare Alexander Archipelago wolf, Sitka black-tailed deer, and more than 350 species of birds. Offshore, humpbacks and orcas move through nutrient-rich waters tied directly to the forest's tail. Robert: The Tongass is also a global climate powerhouse. It stores more carbon per acre than nearly any forest on Earth. About 20% of all carbon in the entire U.S. national forest system. Protecting it is one of the most effective climate actions available. Theresa: And that is one of the missions of the Boat Company to protect the Tongass. It's also the traditional homeland of the Tlingit, Haida, and Tsimshian peoples, whose cultures, food systems, and identities are deeply rooted in this land. Robert: But the Tongass is not invulnerable. Its greatest threat has always been industrial logging, especially old-growth logging. These ancient trees take centuries to grow and seconds to fall. Once they're gone, the ecosystem doesn't simply bounce back. Theresa: And this is where the roadless rule becomes critical. The roadless rule protects more than 9 million acres of the Tongass from new road building and large-scale industrial development. When the rule is in place, these areas remain intact, but many hope for it to be lifted. Those areas then become open to old-growth timber harvest, mining exploration and development, road construction that fragments habitat and damages salmon streams. Robert: Roads may sound harmless, but in the Tongass, they are the first cut. They open remote islands to logging. They increase erosion into salmon streams. They fracture wildlife habitat. And they create long-term ecological scars that take generations to heal. Theresa: Climate change adds another layer of pressure to the Tongass. Warming rivers, shifting precipitation patterns, and stressing of salmon populations. The Tongass is resilient. But even a huge rainforest has its limits. Robert: This is why the Boat Company exists. Not just to show people the Tongass, but to help protect it. To fund research, restoration, and long-term stewardship of one of the last intact temperate rainforests on Earth. Theresa: Sailing with the Boat Company did show us what a fragile environment the Tongass is. Even though it's strong, it does have its very gentle side. It's almost sad to hear about some of the projects planned for the area. Definitely see it now before it turns into who knows what. The Lissarone and Miskol, they aren't cruise ships. They're more like floating yachts. They have warm wood, soft light, quiet corners, and an attentive crew that knows your name and preferences by the second day. Robert: With only a couple dozen guests, everything feels personal. You're not a passenger, you're part of a small community moving through this vast wilderness. Theresa: And let's talk about the daily experience on board. The days unfold gently. There are skiff rides into quiet coves, hikes through old-growth forests, kayaking on the glassy water, watching waves surface in the distance, or seeing glacier scathe. Robert: The plan is usually that there's one activity in the morning and another in the afternoon, but that itinerary flexes with wildlife and weather. If whales appear, you stop. If bears are feeding, you linger. If the water is perfect for kayaking, they launch the kayaks. Theresa: The meals on board are thoughtful and unhurried, fresh seafood, local ingredients, and stories shared around the table. At the table, the meals are served family style, which was a different experience for us. I haven't decided if I preferred that type of dining. There's no menu. The meals are written on a whiteboard in the dining area. Everybody sits at one huge table, and it's a time to talk about the day or to recap what's happened during the day. Robert: Now, if you have dietary restrictions or preferences, for instance, if you're a vegan, if you need to avoid seafood, if you have other preferences, they try very hard to accommodate those. Theresa: They were very good at doing that, very willing to make something. If you didn't like one of the side dishes or a certain dessert or the main course, the chef would come up with something just for you. Robert: There's always a moment, usually around day 3, when you realize you've slowed down. You're breathing differently. You're noticing things again. Theresa: Wow, like that fresh, crisp air, the way the clouds curl around a mountain, the way a salmon stream sounds up close, and the way silence can feel full, not empty. Robert: And that's the magic of the boat company. It's not just a trip, it's a recalibration, a reminder of what untouched nature feels like. Theresa: Now let's talk a little about the accessibility for body-diverse travelers. First, this is a small, yacht-like ship. There are thresholds. There are stairs to get into the skiffs and into the kayaks. Always the staff is there to assist, but it can still be a little bit scary, at least for me. It did take extra caution to get into both the skiffs and the kayaks. Actually, the kayaks were far more difficult to get out of than to get into. And it did work for me, and that is also with limitations. There were areas that were extremely difficult to access. Our cabin was on the main deck, and I recommend if you have any mobility issues, that is the best deck, because there are steep stairs to the second and third deck. The main deck is where all of the action is. If you can navigate the threshold out of your stateroom into the lounge and dining room, which also has threshold, you will do fairly well, as long as you are able to lift your legs up and over. I would not recommend this cruise for anybody in a wheelchair. Now, a folding walker might work for you. The showers are walk-in, so if you do that with a walker, that's a possibility. You do not have to go on any of the excursions. Several people spent the day in the lounge or looking at the wilderness, the sea, people fishing, just from the comfort of the boat. Nothing is mandatory. Robert: The crew were very willing to adjust and adapt any activities to make sure that you had a very pleasant experience. Theresa: And in my case, I had several adaptations. One day I wanted to go fishing, but I guess I thought I'd have to stand up in one of the skiffs and didn't think that was for me and wasn't sure that I had the fortitude, I guess, to spend three hours fishing. I'm too much of an instant gratification person. And that is one very interesting thing about the boat company. Fishing is an option, and it was maybe one of the most popular options. Whenever it was available, I think a majority of the passengers signed up to fish. Some even caught fish and shipped it home. Some fish the chef used. And people just loved the fishing. They caught different types of fish. Halibut was the one to catch. Then there was rockfish. Robert: There were opportunities to do both saltwater fishing and freshwater fishing. That you could take a skiff, go onto land, and there were freshwater streams. They would provide waders so that you could go into the stream and buy fish. Theresa: Right. And there were some avid fishermen in the group, and they brought all their own fishing equipment, including waders. So since we're talking about some of the daily activities, besides that, we did kayaking. If the water were rough, they did not launch kayaks. There were alternatives. I think fishing happened every single day because they were in the larger motorized skiffs, so you didn't need any effort to get the skiff to the watering hole. There were some hikes. I attempted a hike. We were told that one of the brothers' islands was like a fairy tale setting full of moss everywhere. And key for me, there were no bears. I don't run very fast, and I might not see the bear in the first place. But I went as far as was comfortable for me. There were a lot of roots and branches and obstructions along the way, so I just found a nice log and sat there, along with one of the staff who insisted on staying with me. We sat down there while the others hiked, and we solved all the problems of the world. And it was just a very nice, comfortable, peaceful place to be. Robert: And the guides were naturalists. Some of them specialized in birding, and others specialized in the mosses and the flora. It was always a very educational walk when we took the hikes. Theresa: Right, and every evening we had a recap of the day and learned all about what we had seen that day or what we would see the next day. I think one of the highlights for many people, and that's besides seeing the sea lions, the seals, the otters, the bears, the whales, was going into Dawes Glacier and seeing a huge chunk of ice calf from the glacier. That was amazing. We were in the skiffs. We waited and waited and waited. For me, I could wait three hours to watch a glacier calf, a little bit longer than I could to catch a fish. Robert: But the skiff journey up to the face of the glacier was fascinating because we had to dodge multiple icebergs, and we had different views of the glacier, and it really did look different from when the skiff would move from one side of the Sound to the other. Theresa: And we kind of figured out one of the big pieces of ice, and there were some little smaller calving, but one place started to get bluer and bluer and almost semi-transparent, looked like maybe a stained glass blue window. And sure enough, that was the piece that decided calf. Robert: And the different kinds of ice, it was fascinating because some of it was crystal clear. You could see right through it, and other pieces were just very white and foggy, and then there were always the blue pieces, which were fascinating. Theresa: Right, so everything could be adapted to your liking. And you were welcome to go up into the bridge, but that required walking up the steep staircases, which I did do a couple times. Did have double handrails, and of course Robert always helps me, but that was dicey. If you do consider going to Southeast Alaska with the boat company, be sure to call them and ask them for advice. They know the boats very well, and they can assist you in picking a stateroom and a location. We had a bunk bed, queen at the bottom, and I guess single at the top. We just slept in the bottom. But some of the rooms did have twin beds, especially if you don't want to sleep with your traveling mate, it's nice to have the option of the two single beds. Cabins were small enough, we did have an extra folding chair, we had plenty of storage space, there was a reading light above the bed, we had a screen door and a heavy wooden door in the cabins, and usually it was fairly quiet, except on the first deck, you are right above the engine room. Robert: The main deck sits right on top of the engine room, and several of the cabins would be right over where the anchors were released and then drawn back up, so that it was occasionally noisy. It also has a side thruster in the front of the ship, so when that was used, it was also a little bit loud. Theresa: But other than that, I think we were tired enough by the end of the day, and the ship always anchored in a quiet cove overnight, which was really, really nice. Robert: On the last day, you got to see a behind-the-scenes tour of where the crew slept, we could actually go down into the engine room, we could actually see the engines, and these had been recently rebuilt, and they were much smaller than the original engines, so there was much more room. We also got to see the galley and different storage places. Theresa: That was something I opted not to do, just because the engine room, I think it could be tricky. Robert: There were steep stairs down, and getting back up, you had to be very careful. Theresa: Right, and I don't ever want to fall, so as much as I would have liked to have seen that, I did not. I think one nice place is the lounge, they have a full bar there, soft drinks, tea and coffee available all day, and that's where people would hang out after expeditions, or if they chose not to go on an expedition, they could just sit and read, or there's a small library there. Robert: There were nice viewing windows, you could always sit and watch the shoreline go by if the boat was sailing, or when it was anchored, you could easily see the shoreline. Sometimes you could walk out to the railing, and look for the charismatic megafauna, as they like to call it. Theresa: So who might find this challenging? We talked about this a little bit. Wheelchair users, it would be nearly impossible to even board, and if you have unsure footing, even if you use the walker on flat surfaces, it might be very difficult to board. But again, please call the boat company, and get their expert opinion. If you need a rolling shower, maybe you should forget that. And if you can't manage stairs at all, it won't work for you. But other than that, I found it okay to navigate, and I am the worst at seeing wildlife, just because they don't see very well. But they do share pictures at the end, and most people are patient, they move skiffs around, turn them around, so that you could get close to like a starfish, for example. But all in all, I thought it was a very worthwhile experience. And the best part is you are contributing to really the life of the Tongass National Forest. Robert: And it's preservation. Theresa: And it is preservation. So next time, we will talk about tours by locals. We joined one of the tours in Architectural, toured in South Beach, Florida, all at a conference, and we'll let you know what we thought of that. If you haven't already downloaded the workbook, or visited Amazon, please look for our very recently published workbook, a 70-day workbook for living well with body disruptions. Again, you can find it on Amazon, we'll list it in the show notes. Until next week, thank you for joining Living the Good Life. Show Notes

Music

The Boat Company

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Disruption

Choosing Accessible Accommodations

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 26 May 2026 22:27:11 +0000

In this episode we share details about choosing accommodations for people with disabilities. You may be surprised to know that ADA only requests that lodging institutions meet minimal standards to comply. Comfort and ADA may be two totally different things.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript : Theresa: I once checked into an ADA compliant hotel room and it was not what I expected. The shower chair was in the closet, the bed was too high, and the rolling shower had a three inch lip. Robert: And that's when you know this trip just got complicated. Theresa: Today we're talking about accessible lodging, what ADA compliance really means, why it can be misleading, and how to choose a place that actually works for your needs. Robert: And we're also talking about something that gets overlooked way too often, comfort and support for caregivers. Theresa: Welcome back to Living the Could Life. Robert: I'm Theresa Robert: and I'm your co-host Robert. Let's get into it. Robert: We've all seen the blue and green sign from the highway. Holiday Inn Express is the king of the consistent stay. But if you're a traveler with a disability, is consistent always a good thing? Theresa: To some, it's a lifesaver. To others, it's a minefield of almost accessible features. Today we're breaking down what it's really like to navigate mid-scale chain hotels, the psychology of why we pick them, and the red flag phrases that should make you run for the hills. Robert: I used to think these hotels were so bland. It's like they copy-pasted the room across 2,000 locations. Everything is always in the same exact spot. Isn't that boring? Theresa: Well, to you, and formerly to me, it was bland. But then, it's a map I have already memorized. When I roll into a Holiday Inn Express, I don't have to solve the puzzle of the room. I already know the bathroom's here. The bed height's predictable. And I can reach the light switch from the bed. Robert: So the lack of surprise is actually the luxury? Theresa: Exactly. In my world, and for many others with body disruptions, a surprise is usually a barrier. That boring layout reduces my cognitive load. I'll take predictable over pretty every day of the week. Robert: Let's talk about the booking process. I called a hotel last week for a friend and asked about the roll-in shower. And the guy at the desk said, it's pretty accessible. What does pretty accessible even mean? Theresa: In hotel speak, that means the door is wide, but good luck getting to the sink. It's a huge red flag. If they use adjectives like pretty, mostly, should be fine, or I think so, it means they haven't had real accessibility. A real accessibility audit. Robert: So if I hear it should be fine, I should probably keep looking? Theresa: I think I would run or ask them to specifically go look at the room. Sometimes even when we check in, they can't tell you. Or at least get a manager on the phone. You might, you want to hear nouns and numbers. The bed's 22 inches high. The shower has a built-in bench. That's the language of a safe stay. Robert: So I'm at the my luggage. Isn't that just standard business? Theresa: Well, we just ran into this recently. And for me, or for others who have a chair with battery life, you have a waiting limit and you can't always control when your flight arrives. You might need to access medical supplies. You can't just dig through those in a crowded lobby. Or what if you have to change something like a colostomy bag or take medications? When a hotel charges you to access a room that you need for your health, they're not just charging for time, they're charging for your disability. Robert: That feels like a disability surcharge. How do you fight that? Theresa: Well, join the loyalty programs. Often basic status even gets you a guaranteed late checkout or a waived early fee. It also lets you put a permanent note in your profile like requires first floor. So the desk sees it before you even arrive. Robert: You can't talk about Holiday Inn Express without the free breakfast. Theresa: Um, it's usually pretty good, but sometimes it could be a challenge. Some of the pancake machines and cereal dispensers are designed for standing adults. They're way too high for a seated guest. Robert: What's the move there? Just skip the pancakes? Theresa: Ah, never skip the pancakes. There's no problem with asking for help. You could ask for a reasonable modification. A staff member can get your cereal and bring tray to a lower table. A good hotel knows that hospitality does not stop at the bedroom door. Robert: What if they're sold out and the accessible room they gave me is actually a disaster? Theresa: This is where the ADA walk comes in. If a hotel cannot provide the disability specific room you booked, it's their responsibility to find you a room at a nearby hotel that is accessible, pay for the ride there, and cover any price difference. Robert: So, you aren't being a difficult guest by demanding what you booked? Theresa: No, not at all. You're asking for the room you paid for. Accessibility isn't a special feature. It's the foundation of the say. It's the foundation of the stay. And, one tip is to, before you even check in, reconfirm your reservation. Be sure that they do have an accessible room for you. So, now let's talk about a big myth. ADA compliance equals accessibility. Robert: Spoiler, it doesn't. ADA compliance is the minimum a hotel has to do, not the comfort level you actually need. Theresa: Exactly. ADA requires things like wider doorways, grab bars, a rolling shower, or tub with a seat, visual alarms, and lowered peep holes. Robert: But, ADA doesn't guarantee the things that actually matter in real life. Theresa: Like a functioning shower chair. You don't need one that's wobbly. Robert: Or, a bed that isn't 30 inches high. Theresa: Or, a shower without a lip that you have to step over. Robert: Or, enough space to turn a wheelchair. Theresa: Or, a thermostat you can reach. Robert: Or, a room that isn't a mile from the elevator. Theresa: So, when a hotel says ADA compliant, what they really mean is, we checked the boxes. Now, we made this comfortable or functional. Robert: Let's talk about what's actually available. Because, accessibility isn't one size fits all. Theresa: Right. Different disabilities need different things. Let's break it down. For mobility, you want to ask about the actual shower setup. Not just whether it's roll-in. Robert: Because, a roll-in shower with a three-inch lip is not a roll-in. Theresa: And, who would really say it's accessible? Also, be sure that it has bars to hang on to. Maybe a shower mat so you don't slip. You also want to know the bed height, the space around the bed, and whether the shower chair is attached or portable. Robert: For sensory needs, quiet rooms matter. Away from elevators, ice machines, and HVAC. Theresa: And, lighting. Dimmable lights, blackout curtains, and no flickering bulbs. For people with neurodiversity, predictable layouts are huge. Robert: Yes, chains are great for this. We'll talk about that later. For chronic illness, refrigerators for medication, temperature control, and easy access to exits. Theresa: And, seating in the hallways or the lobby. People often forget how important that is. As far as service animals, there should be relief areas, staff training, and no additional pet fees. Robert: And, space for the animal to rest comfortably. Okay, let's talk about the caregivers. Because, they're often invisible in these conversations. Theresa: Caregivers need comfort, too. They need rest, privacy, and a layout that doesn't put them at risk. Robert: A separate sleeping space, even a partial divider, can make a huge difference. Theresa: And, bathrooms matter for caregivers, too. They need space to assist. Robert: Lower beds help caregivers avoid back strain. Theresa: And, rooms close to the elevator help everyone. Especially, caregivers carrying equipment or supplies. Robert: Caregivers deserve dignity and support. Caregivers deserve dignity and comfort. They're part of the accessibility equation. Theresa: So, why are chain hotels like the Holiday Inn Express lifesavers? Here's something people don't expect. Chain hotels can be a fantastic choice. Robert: Predictability is accessibility. Theresa: Chains use standardized designs. Robert: So, once you learn one layout, you can navigate others easily. Theresa: The bed height's consistent. Robert: Bathroom layout is consistent. Theresa: Furniture spacing is consistent. Robert: And, staff training tends to be better. Theresa: Predictability reduces stress for disabled travelers and caregivers. Robert: Let's talk about red flags. Theresa: So, one story we heard is that Ray Charles really enjoyed staying at the Holiday Inn. And, this was a long time ago. I don't think Holiday Inn Express even existed. And, Holiday Inn was one of the first hotel chains that focused on identical layouts and rooms so that people knew exactly what to expect when they booked a room there. For somebody, especially like me, with visual impairment. And, I guess, Ray Charles felt the same, too. Once you're in that room, you know where the bathroom is, where the bed is, where the light switch is, and everything about the room. So, you feel instantly comfortable there. You're not stressing about how to navigate or if you find something or hurt yourself. So, that is a real bonus. Robert: So, let's talk about hidden problems no one warns you about. The red flags. Theresa: Uh, like rolling showers with surprised lips. Robert: Shower chairs that wobble. Theresa: Beds that are too high for transfers. Robert: Accessible rooms at the end of long hallways. Theresa: Thermostats that are placed too high. Robert: And, my personal favorite, the peephole at six feet. And, even though I stand five foot eight, that can sometimes be a stretch. Theresa: So, how do you book lodging that actually works for you? First of all, think about where you've stayed in the past and listen to people like us who have stayed at such lodging. I don't know if you remember from a previous podcast, we said for cruisers with disabilities, once they find a cruise line that does a great job with them, they return to that cruise line. And, I recommend the same for hotels. Like, in my case, I prefer a room, especially if I'm there a long time, that has more than just a desk chair and a bed to sit on. Who wants to sit on a bed for two days? We also look, when we travel with our neurodiverse son, rooms that have separate bedrooms, each with their own bathroom. And, that is not easy to find at all. But, one thing that I really like, and when we researched or booked, we stayed at several Holiday Inn Expresses, is there is a place to stay where you can be comfortable. You don't just have to sit on a bed all day. Robert: How to book a lodging that actually works. Theresa: So, how do you find a lodging place that actually works? As I just said, if you found a place that checks all the boxes for you, just return there. You don't have to worry or ask. You know where everything is. You know that you're treated well and you can feel comfortable there. And, here's a script you should use for calling a hotel. Robert: Ask for photos of the exact room you'll be staying in. Theresa: Not a sample room and not a stock photo. I often look at images provided by the guests to get a truer idea. Robert: Ask about the bed height, the shower setup, the space around the bed, and the distance from the elevator. Theresa: And, I think one thing we haven't mentioned, I'm surprised to find accessible bathrooms that may have a bar near the toilet, but they do not have a comfort height toilet for people with hip, knee, or other bodily disruptions. It can be hard to squat down to what I call the kitty potty. So, besides that, you can also ask housekeeper if they can use fragrance-free cleaning products. Robert: You deserve accurate information, not surprises. Theresa: So, today we talked about what ADA compliance really means. Robert: Why it's often misleading. Theresa: What to look for in accessible lodging. Robert: Why chain hotels can be a great choice. Theresa: And, how to book a room that actually works. Robert: And, we talked about caregivers because their comfort matters too. Theresa: And, we have used on cruising. We always recommend arriving a day early. In Tampa, we found several Holiday Inns and for us, we knew what to expect there. And, after traveling all day, having delays, having a delayed ship coming into port, it was good to know that we could find something that would have that extra space for us and the extra place to sit, which is, for me, now a requirement. Next time, we'll talk about our recent expedition cruise in Alaska with The Boat Company and how easy it is to navigate if you have any type of body disruptors. And, we also did want to announce that earlier we had provided a link to a workbook for you to download. We're happy to announce that we decided that the workbook was such a good idea that it's been redone and is very extensive. It's Living the Could Life, a 70-Day Workbook For People with Body Disruptions. And, that is available at amazon.com and I'll add a link to the show notes. So, follow Living the Could Life so that you never miss an episode. Robert: And, share this with someone who travels with a disability or supports someone who does. Theresa: See you next time. Thank you for joining us at Living The Could Life. Show Notes

Music

Holiday Inn Express

Living The Could Life - A 70-Day Workbook For Living Well After Body Disruption

Living the Could Life First Season Recap

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 19 May 2026 13:37:30 +0000

About this Episode:

This episode recaps our first season of episodes. We made it! We will continue sharing information on adjusting to later-in-life changes with an emphasis on continuing to travel after such body disruptions.

We have several free downloades of helpful information in the previous episodes and have recently published a full workbook to help you change your habits so that you can successfully adapt to the body that you have today.

You will find that helpful resourse - LIving the Could Life: A 70-day Workbook for living Well After Body Disruptions

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Theresa: Welcome to Living the Good Life. I'm Theresa. Robert: And I'm Robert. We recently broadcast our 10th episode and are celebrating that milestone this week. Theresa: We created Living the Good Life for those who suddenly found that their body's performance doesn't sync with their mental attitude. In fact, you've come to the right place, and if you've been listening to us since the beginning, thank you so much. Navigating disability, chronic illness, aging, or any kind of life change was not in your plans? Please join us. Robert: In our past episodes, we have talked about the two meanings of could, 70 days to change, and also about how to cruise in Alaska and the Great Lakes. Theresa: We've also added several complimentary downloads to help guide you through your personal journey while dealing with later in life body disruptions. Robert: In addition to all this, we have created a full workbook, Living the Good Life, a 70-day workbook for living well after body disruption, which you will find for sale on amazon.com. Theresa: We'll add that link to the show notes. We will be back next week for the start of our second season. Please join us to learn about accommodations, cruising on an expedition cruise in Alaska with the nonprofit cruise operator, The Boat Company. There is a lot more coming in our second season. See you next week. Thanks for listening to Living the Good Life. (Transcribed by TurboScribe. Go Unlimited to remove this message.) Show Notes

Music

Music Credits (click to expand)

Carpe Diem — Kevin MacLeod Licensed under CC BY 4.0 https://incompetech.com

Ascending the Vale — Kevin MacLeod Licensed under CC BY 4.0 https://incompetech.com

Bloom — Pixabay Music Licensed under Pixabay Content License https://pixabay.com/music/

Cruising the Great Lakes with Victory I

Robert and Theresa — Tue, 12 May 2026 08:14:00 +0000

Part 2 - The Ship

In this episode we share details about the ship itself. How does it work for those with disabilities? What is a typical daily schedule? Which features keep guests returning?

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Robert: Welcome to Living the Could Life. I'm Robert and we recently returned from a Great Lakes cruise leaving out of Toronto and ending up in Chicago. Theresa: And I'm Theresa. We sailed on Victory One. It's the first cruise of the Great Lakes for the season, so that's very exciting and we're happy to be on board. Robert: We're going to talk about the airport, the hotel, the ship, and we've discussed the itinerary already and we're going to concentrate mostly on accessibility and what it was like to move around on the ship and the rooms, the restaurants. Theresa: And that's correct. If you go and look at a previous, actually one we talked about the Great Lakes in general and there is a part one of this podcast where we mostly talked about the ports on the cruise. So we are going to start from the beginning and that includes, We left home for a short drive of about an hour to the Manistee airport and we took a flight. Robert: I believe it was 21 minutes over to Chicago and then in Chicago we picked up a flight going to Toronto. Theresa: And we arrived in Toronto and going through immigration was fairly quick and easy, but getting, well, getting an Uber was also easy. Getting to our hotel, the Westin Harbor Castle in downtown right near the islands right in the center of town, took a bit of time because a lot of the roads had been closed. The main quick arteries. Robert: The Gardner expressway. Theresa: Like the Gardner. So we had to take just, I guess I'll say not such quick streets. So it took us maybe over an hour. Robert: In what should have been probably a 20 minute drive, I think. Theresa: And then our Uber driver was not so sure of where the hotel was and you can't blame him because we got there and the entrance isn't really that easy to see. He stopped down the street, but you actually have to turn down the next block and there's a parking garage which you go through and up two levels to get to the main entrance of the hotel. Robert: So you can drive the winding driveway up to the main entrance or from the street level you can take two flights of stairs up and then there is around the corner, if you're facing the hotel on the right side, there is an accessible entrance. It's usually activated with a key card, but if you're just coming to the hotel for the first time you can hit the intercom and they will open the door for you. And then from there it's just a short walk to the elevator and you can go up two levels to the main lobby. Theresa: However, I think when you have your luggage and it's unfamiliar to you, just get dropped off right at that main entrance because you're very close to the check-in and Victory, I almost said Viking, right? Victory does have like a hospitality desk so you can go and check in there. They will give you instructions as to where to meet the bus the next morning. And what is nice is that Victory is smart. I think they know about all the delays in travel and they maybe don't want to wait for people who have been delayed. So the first day of your cruise, and which is included in the fare, is a hotel stay. So that's really nice. And on that day, well, the next day they have options of a short excursion. So I know a lot of people took one that gave them a tour of Toronto. We've been there many times so we did some things on our own. You can listen and hear all about that in the previous podcast. And they told us what time to check in for boarding because you cannot walk to the port. You need to take a bus. So they had several buses arranged and we all had a scheduled time to meet in the lobby to catch the bus and go to where the Victory One was docked. Robert: And I think there were about 150 passengers this time. The bus held like 40 something. And so they had to make several trips to get everybody from the hotel to the dock. Theresa: And we did leave our luggage out so we weren't encumbered with having to take luggage into the bus unless you were like us. We did keep a few things out because we don't want to pack our computers or meds or anything like that under the bus. But all of the luggage was transported by bus. Robert: And delivered to our room, to our cabin. Theresa: It delivered to our cabin. When we got there I think we were on a 330 bus which in a way was an awkward time. Well we had done things earlier in the day so we didn't really have time for lunch. And when we boarded the ship they did have some light snacks and drinks for us. So let's give you a tour of the ship. And one is always a good place to start. So deck one is where the coastal dining room is. And that's the main dining room. There actually is another area. The kitchen's down there or the galley I should say. The one thing we found interesting is although it's the main dining room there are no public restrooms on that floor. Toward the bow of the ship there are some state rooms and a medical center. Robert: Deck one is also where you may board the ship. The gangway was usually coming out of either deck one or deck two. Theresa: Right. It depended on the height of the lake. And what was really nice about dining on the ship is the they had the always available items like lots of ships do. And you could have dinner from 6 30 to 8. There's no assigned seating. You can just go at your leisure. Most of the tables seat four or more people. There's a couple two toppers. Robert: And there's some eight toppers. Theresa: And there are eight toppers. So it's a good way to meet new people. And we usually sat with different people every night except when we didn't feel like it. You know if we didn't feel up to socializing we could find one of the two toppers. Or if we went later we could do that. Robert: And a full breakfast is served there. Lunch is served there. And dinner is served every day. And for dinner it was very interesting. I've not really experienced this before but as you walk in the entrance is sort of a long hallway. And on the right there's a countertop like a kitchen counter that they display everything that's going to be available on the menu. And it's the real food that has actually been cooked and prepared and presented there. And it was interesting because sometimes it would get a little congested getting into the dining room because people would gather and they'd start looking at the different dishes. And so the seating was maybe a little tight. It was it was different. And you know it is a small ship. There are lots of people. So the chairs are pretty close together. And they're larger upholstered chairs. So they're very comfortable. Theresa: Right. And it's a very elegant dining room with white table cloths and white napkins and set up with two wine glasses and water. It was a very pleasant place. And all surrounded by windows so you could enjoy the scenery while you were eating. And since we are talking about that main dining room we can go into a little bit about the food. Robert: Yeah. We had different meals every day. The they had as Teresa mentioned there were certain options that were available every day. They usually had three of those options. It was like a filet, a salmon, and maybe a chicken dish. And then they usually had I think it was probably four other entrees that were that would change every day. And the sides were also included in the entree. But you could also get additional vegetables or a twice baked potato as your side. Theresa: And it was really a four course meal. You start it with appetizers. Sometimes the chef's out in a mousse bouche. And besides the appetizers the next thing was soups and salads. And Robert really likes a real Caesar salad which they had. I think he should just ask for a bowl full of anchovies. I still let him sit at the same table. Robert: It was a real treat for me. Theresa: It was a real treat for him as was having fish every night because we don't eat that much at home. One thing I really really liked is the food was always hot. So if you got soup it wasn't cool. It wasn't lukewarm. It was hot as it should be. And every meal that I had was hot. It sounds like a little thing but it was very important. Robert: They always had a red wine and a white wine that they offered. They circulated constantly with that. You could also order other drinks. I usually had iced tea with my dinners. Other people ordered different things from the bar. We did not have a bad meal on the ship. Every meal was good and I would have certainly repeated any of them. Theresa: Yes they were very good. Well prepared. And like Robert said we tried to think was there anything we really didn't like and the answer to that was no. So I definitely give their food good reviews. The service was good. I think there were some newer people though but being the first cruise on the Great Lakes, I believe the second they started on the St. Lawrence Seaway, if you go early you got to give people a little grace. But the servers were friendly, engaging, and by the end we had our favorite server. And Robert also likes iced coffee which some people don't understand what that is. It's a glass of ice with coffee poured over it. It's not like the iced coffee you get in New Zealand that's dessert. But once the server, every morning once the server knew him he got his reputation. Every morning his iced coffee was ready. Robert: And it was, sorry, and it was a real treat. Shall we move on to deck two? Deck two is the more active deck. There's a lot more happening on deck two. Theresa: Right that's where you have all your lectures. There is a lake lorien who tells everything you need to know about the Great Lakes. We also had a photojournalist as a guest who told us about his life. He did mostly sports and we happened to be there during the Kentucky Derby which was one of the events he photographed. And that's where you hear what's going on the next day. So you should go there to find out what time you disembark with an overview of the shore excursions. Our cruise director, interestingly enough, was also a musician. So there was the Victory One Band which they were fun. They played a variety of music. Lots of people dancing and people were excited to go there sometimes. That was a full house in the evening. And then behind that area is the tavern which is a smaller bar but cozy enough and a lot of people hung out there. In the morning they have pastries, muesli that everybody loves, coffee, tea. Later in the afternoon they have a popcorn machine so you could get popcorn there. They sometimes show movies there. It was just the hub of activity. It was the hub of activity. And outside of that there were two restrooms. Robert: I wanted to say something more. Say it. Okay. The coffee machines were available 24 hours a day. They had the cappuccino option. They had americano. They had a variety of choices of lattes and such. And in the morning from about 6 to 10 they offered pastries. And then at 10 o'clock it changed over to cookies. And so from 10 a.m. to 10 p.m. there were always cookies and always well stocked to go along with your coffee. Theresa: But just be aware, if you're like me and not a raisin fan, some of those raisin cookies look like melted chocolate was in them. So I accidentally had one. Robert said they were still very good. I just don't like the surprise of thinking I'm having chocolate chip and I get raisins. Robert: I like raisins though. Theresa: Yeah, he likes raisins. I'm sorry for him. Robert: But Teresa was starting to explain that beyond the Compass Lounge is the purser's desk, restrooms, the spa salon, and then a very small gym. Theresa: And the elevator's there too. And the elevator goes up four decks. It does not go to the sun deck. So I never saw it, but Robert did. And what's, we found some of the crew very entertaining. We took a look in the gym and I never saw any people there, which is okay because we were busy all day. I think it probably had three machines in it. Robert: Yeah, it had three machines, a treadmill, one of the kind of skiing machines, and then a bicycle, some sort of bicycle. Theresa: But there was room there, so you had no excuse not to exercise if you weren't getting enough exercise on shore. There's also a spa there and we met some people who were on the St. Lawrence Seaway part of the cruise and they said they love the masseuse there and had gone several times. Robert: Moving up to deck three. Theresa: Three, that's an easy one. It's all cabins. And we can talk about the different cabins since it's all cabins. Robert: There's one more thing on deck three. At the rear of the ship there is a staircase that will take you up into the grill. And otherwise the entrances to the grill are out in the open. And if it's raining and such you might get a little wet, but you can simply go down the hallway for deck three and take the inside staircase up to the top. Theresa: Oh, so we were going to talk about different kinds of cabins. There are different sizes of cabins, most with queen or two single beds. They range from 146 square feet up to 185 unless you are in the owner's suite, which is 335 square feet. So that's a good size. And the cabins have a refrigerator and stocked with drinks. Victory is an all-inclusive cruise, so you can have beer and pop because it's the Midwest. It's not the soda there. And you could make requests, say you like Coke or Sprite or a certain type of beer. They will take care of that. Robert: Our cabin was on deck four and the entrance is from an open-air promenade. So we had a very private entrance and it was very pleasant. We had a couple of days of rain, but there was also a little bit of a covering over the entryway, so we really didn't get that wet. Theresa: Right, and it wasn't that far of a walk. That was one spot, and I will say as far as our our state room, you do have the outside door and I think twice we got stuck in our room. I don't know if it was because it was too cold, but they immediately came and fixed it. And there are not a lot of high thresholds, even in the room. The bathroom had a short threshold and I think if you've cruised a lot, you instinctively lift up your foot to step over the threshold, even if it doesn't exist. So the bathrooms though, if you need a wheelchair, it might be difficult. They're small and the shower has a very high lip on it, and it's round in a corner and it has the curtains that wrap you in the wetness or warmth or whatever. At least mine did. Robert: And if you're going through a door that leads to the outside, the threshold was a little bit higher to prevent water from entering. If you were on an interior hallway and going into interior rooms, there was really no significant threshold that you'd have to navigate. Theresa: And we enjoyed our room and we had blackout curtains which were nice. We did have some people thinking, oh someone was lost at the beginning staring into our window and I can't remember which. Robert: She was trying to find the hallway to get to the stairs or the elevator and she had sort of lost her bearing and wasn't sure and was thinking that our cabin door was the door into the hallway, which was actually in the middle of the ship. Theresa: Right. So clearly it was not, but she was a pleasant enough person and a little bit embarrassed. And we didn't really care because we didn't. The other two advantages of being on deck four, one is that there is a terrace at the front of the ship. So we enjoyed sitting out there sometimes. We also had two chairs and a table right outside ours, so we had our own private seating. But it was a little chilly and sometimes windy. In fact, sometimes it was so windy that the rattan sofas from the terrace flew all the way down to our room, which was interesting. The other. Robert: The rattan sofas were very nice to sit on on the bow, especially while we were sailing or we were coming into port. You had a beautiful view from there. Theresa: That was very nice. And then at the opposite end of the ship is the grill, and that's a specialty restaurant. It is included. They, and you have to make a reservation though, and they do have assigned, well, certain times you can sit wherever they put you sometimes. At the beginning of the cruise, they seemed to seat us with other people. At the end, they just said, take a seat anywhere. So that was interesting. But the grill actually has heated stones where you cook your meat or your fish or your whatever, your, I forget, the vegetarian. Robert: So it was a, they called it an interactive dining experience. And they would bring the stone out to your table, heat it to 400 degrees, and then you would order whatever meat you wanted. I believe the options were usually some sort of beef, fish of the day. They had lamb. Some days they had jumbo shrimp. And then they also had kind of a mixed grill, which was a bit of beef, a bit of ham, and I think a large shrimp. Theresa: I think it was everything, all of the above. Robert: And you cooked it yourself, and you could cut it up and sort of, or you could cook it as one sort of piece, or you could cut it up into slices and sort of cook it through that way. Theresa: And they did bring us aprons to put on. Robert: Yes, yes, that was interesting. Theresa: Which I could use one just when I'm not even cooking my food. Robert: And then when your food was done, they provided you with a plate on the side. You could just move your meat or your protein or whatever you were cooking onto the plate. And then the sides were all served in sort of family style. They had serving dishes that we had mushrooms, we had some sort of like roasted potatoes, and some vegetables, broccoli and some other things. And then I think on some days you could actually, you could order a pasta or something like that. Theresa: In the grill? Robert: In the grill, yes. I think it was the first time I ordered the pasta. Theresa: You didn't cook? Robert: I did cook, but the pasta was a side. Theresa: Oh, in addition. The pasta was a side. Robert: In addition, the pasta was a side. Theresa: Yeah, that was an addition. So there was plenty of food, and it was fun cooking. Just be careful you don't burn yourself on the stump. Robert: Now the grill, at other times, in the morning it's sort of a buffet kind of breakfast. There is an omelet station, and then there's a variety of pastries, and cereals, and the muesli, and yogurts, and other things. Theresa: Coffee tea. Robert: Coffee tea that you can pick up on your own. And then for lunch, kind of the same thing. It was a buffet, and they had kind of like a build your own hamburger, a hot dog, and then usually maybe some kind of fish or something else, a pasta or something. Theresa: But the big secret there is there's a freezer there that has individual cartons of ice cream. Robert: Not just any ice cream. They had Haagen-Dazs, and they had Blue Bunny. Theresa: And Ben and Jerry's. Robert: And Ben and Jerry's, yes. Theresa: Yeah, they had several flavors. That was interesting. And at lunch you can also have your wine or beer. I will say it said there would be local beer served, and they were all IPAs. So for the non-IPA beer drinker, that was just harsh. Robert: And above the Deck 4 was Deck 5, which included the Sun Deck that was open to passengers. Now it was only accessible on a sort of a steep stairway. Going up was not really a problem, but coming down was maybe a little bit anxiety-creating. As you went down, your toes were sticking out over the steps. So it's one of those stairways that you actually want to turn around and walk down with your toes first. And remember that toes grip and heels slip. Theresa: Right, and I know some people who they got up, but they weren't sure they could get down. And there was also a bridge tour, but you had to go up to Deck 5. There was no elevator that goes there. I did not go to the bridge tour. Show Notes

Victory Cruise Lines

Review of the Great Lakes Cruise on Victory I

Robert and Theresa — Wed, 06 May 2026 19:08:46 +0000

Part I - The Itinerary

In this episode, we share our opinions of Victory I as she plies the Great Lakes. We pay particular attention to accessibility.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Hi, welcome to living the good life. I'm Theresa and I'm Robert. We are sadly on the last day of our Victory One cruise along the great lakes. We started in Toronto where Victory includes the first night at a hotel, which makes a lot of sense because many people travel, a lot of our fellow cruisers are from California and areas far away areas that aren't on the great lakes. Robert: Although there are a few of us from the Midwest, we landed in Toronto and we want to focus a little bit on the accessibility needs or if there were any problems along the way. And we found navigating the Toronto airport was fairly easy. A bit of walking to finally get to the Uber pickup. Theresa: There was a lot of construction in Toronto. The Gardiner Highway was close, so it took us a little longer, but we did research the Westin Harbourfront Castle, which is where we stayed. It was a great location. We did find an accessible entrance. It's around if you're facing the front and you are on the street because it's a very strange entrance, like you go into a parking garage and there's an entrance. But if you're on the street facing the parking, you just head to the right. And there is a sign there. But unfortunately, they want you to have a room key. If you don't just hit the intercom button and somebody will let you in. Robert: The main entrance to the hotel was actually two stories up from the street level. So you had to drive up a reasonably steep driveway, I guess, up to the front doors. And that was easy enough to do. And that's where you would also pick up your Ubers or taxis or any other transportation if you needed to get down to the street level on the inside, you could take an elevator down two levels and then come out again, the accessibility door that's on the, as Theresa said, on the right side, and it takes you right out to the street. Theresa: And we had looked for it and had a little problem. It looks like a door for the staff or unaccessible, you know, do not go beyond here. So just look when you get off the elevator. You turn left and then it will be on your right. It's like double doors. It is not Walmart. Nothing says accessible. Robert: Once we got outside and the sidewalks were pretty clear, there were curb cuts at all of the intersections and all the crosswalks. The one thing is you really have to watch out for the bicyclists, because when you're going across a crosswalk, there are bicycle lanes that are also going perpendicular to the crosswalk. So you have to look both ways because the bicyclists come in both directions. And there were enough e-bikes that were moving along at a good clip. Theresa: Right. So that all worked out. There was a registration desk with some people representing Victory who gave us the plan. And there were some changes. One thing about cruising anytime is be aware that flexibility is key. And I will say on this particular sailing, and this is the first one of the year, that's always a good time for better rates. But the weather may not be perfect. I have to say that the staff has been amazing. I would say maybe 25 to 30 percent of our fellow cruisers use some kind of mobility aid and they are well accommodated. Many of them said they are living the good life. They've had hip surgery, knee surgery, health issues, and they've adapted. So that they can continue to travel. Robert: The crews provided umbrellas when we needed them, when the weather was bad. The getting onto the ship and getting off the ship required a gangway. Sometimes it was just a flat ramp. Other times it was a stairway that was adjustable to the level of the ship down to the dock. And so and there were often an additional step or something at the bottom. The crew was extremely alert to anyone who was who had some difficulty getting on and off the ship. And we even saw wheelchairs being carried down the ramp. So it was it was just amazing how helpful they were. Theresa: Yes. And there's even wheelchairs on board the ship for your use. But it is very nice. They have this. But never assume that you will have the same experience as we did. I mean, crews change, fellow passengers change, and fellow passengers were very helpful as well. But always remember, it's up to you to research. Come with the right equipment. One woman we spoke with said she usually travels with a regular rolling wheeler, the rectangular shape for traveling on a ship. She has a foldable triangular that has a little place for her to put her things and she can fold it. So it's very narrow. So it doesn't take up room. I think I wish that all cruise ships would have maybe a mobility aid that way or something, because it's a little scary for someone like me who doesn't see well if people leave their walker or wheelchair right in the main aisle or highway. It's also difficult for servers like in the dining room. Robert: On the excursions, one thing that I noticed was that the buses, we had newer buses that followed the ship along to each port. They followed along the highways as the ship cruised to the next port and met us at each port. But the buses were kneeling buses, so the front could be lowered to adjust to like curb height and all. They often had a stepstool at the bottom of the entry. The steps going up were reasonably steep and you had to be pretty careful going up and down in the bus. And I noticed that some of the passengers would get on the bus and actually did not get off at some of the places you could get off and sightsee and such, and that they just preferred to remain on the bus because it did take quite some effort for them to go up and down those steps. Theresa: And that's a perfect alternative because on the bus, you can still look out the window and see where you are and get an idea. So you never are forced to, you know, get off the bus. The driver always stayed with the bus. And, you know, it's a great place just to look, enjoy the area, you know, and be reasonable and don't think, oh, my gosh, I have to get off the bus, because you don't. Robert: Our first stop after Toronto was Niagara. Theresa: Which actually is from Port Colborne. You don't stop right in Niagara Falls because it's not like you can dock a boat there. So that was really nice. And we've been to Niagara many times and we never took a tour of a power station. So we did a power station tour, which took us down a hundred and eighty five feet. Was it something like that? Robert: It was just under 200 feet, I believe. Theresa: There was a half mile walk each way, but the path was clear. There's an elevator. So if you had a wheelchair or a walker, you could do it. The only problem was the time you had to do it, because I felt we were a little bit rushed doing that, but came out right on the bottom of the falls. And they do provide ponchos and the spray wasn't too bad when we were there, but it was an excellent excursion and has a daily included excursion. And that was one of the included excursions. And it was great. Robert: And the elevator ride was actually quite interesting because they had glass panels on one side and you could see all the inner workings of how they control the water flow through the power plant. Theresa: Right. So I highly recommend that. So after Port Colburn, we left and our next stop was Cleveland. The included excursion there was the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. As a person with low vision, I found it very difficult. It's very dark. If you have any kind of sensory issues, there was, I believe, a QR code on the door, but we really didn't see an information place that told you what exactly you should do because the music goes on and on and on. Some people thought it was too loud. Others thought the music's not interesting, which they're lucky they're still on the ship. But some people did a lot, others did a little. It took us three hours just to do the first floor. And that's because we went to the Soul Train. I grew up in Toledo, Soul Train almost seemed like a local show and we watched it and people got to dance there. And we also went through the 13 Beatles albums, which was very interesting. You know, they talked about every album and that took a long time to get through. Robert: There was a video that accompanied each album and the Beatles were actually talking about what they were doing and their progress from their earliest albums to their latest ones. It was, yeah, we were, we stayed there for quite a while and went through each of the albums. There was the accompanying videos. There are six levels in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. And we stayed just on the first level. There are elevators and then each, each floor does change a little bit in elevation. There might be ramps that go up and down in certain areas, but I think it was, you know, it was all clear. There were no real obstacles. Theresa: No, it was good to have the elevator. So that way it was very accessible. But if you have any problems with a lot of noise or getting around when it's dark, it can be a little difficult. They also had an excellent Saturday night live display of all the musicians who performed and that could take an entire day. So if you do this, be sure to sign up for the earliest in the day so you can stay all day. Robert: Our next stop was Detroit. Um, the, we got off the ship, the people mover was not in operation. So we walked a little ways. We got on the queue line and that was very easy. I think, I think it accommodated wheelchairs and we, it's free and we took it and it dropped us off right at the, uh, Detroit museum of art. Theresa: And we had wanted to go to the Detroit Institute of art, which is also accessible. There's elevators and you get a map. We had never seen the Diego Rivera murals, which we wanted to do. So instead of going on the included excursion, which was the wonderful Henry Ford museum, it is not just about cars. It's about manufacturing Americana. It's really a nice museum. And it was also another good choice of what to do in that port. And we had been to it and I shamefully admit, it's probably been 50 years or more, it's been a long time since we've been there, but we knew that Detroit has really good Greek because of Greek town and Mid Eastern food, because a lot of Arabs live in the area. So we went to a Greek restaurant instead of going to Henry Ford and it was well worth it for us. Robert: The restaurant was Pegasus and I think it was the best Greek food I have ever eaten. Theresa: And after Detroit, we had it North. We sailed along like here and it was a sea day. It was our only sea day. Robert: Lake day. Sea day? Theresa: Well, if you call it a lake day, I guess it's a lake day, although the Great Lakes are inland seas, so you can call it what you want, right? Robert: All right. Theresa: But so we did that. It was interesting to learn that we don't take the quickest route because it's more technically difficult. And we did have a pilot on board, like the pilots change for every section that they're in charge of. So we got a little bit delayed. So when we got to Sault Ste. Marie, our next stop, the timing was not right to go through the locks, which is always a fun thing to watch. But as part of that included short excursion, we went to the Valley Camp a freighter, which I worried about because of my vision and I thought it'd be crawling over a lot of thresholds and infrastructure. But, and we did see some people with walkers in there, there is a ramp so you can get up and down to the different levels of the ship. Robert: There were two main levels. Theresa: So that was really good. And it actually snowed when we were there that we weren't expecting that, but it all worked out. Robert: Part of the excursion also included going to the viewing area for the locks where you had two levels that you could see the freighters going through the locks and one of the reasons we couldn't go through the locks was apparently there was some congestion and there were too many freighters around that needed to pass through, but it was amazing to watch them go through the locks. Theresa: As it always is. I did it many times as a kid. There was a third option included in that free excursion. That was to go to a Great Lakes water quality station, but we were on the later tour, so I'd recommend going on the earlier tour so that you can see all three. After Sault Ste. Marie, we went to what was a high point for many passengers and that's Mackinac Island. Robert: And on Mackinac Island, the probably the most popular excursion was, which was included, was the horse carriage rides. And there are some carriages that are actually accessible that you can ask for, you can order, I guess, and they can accommodate a wheelchair. The standard carriages are designed to carry a driver and then 20 passengers in five rows, and so you're kind of tucked in four people to each row. Theresa: And they are not that easy to get into. We might ask if any were accessible. I'm not sure. Robert: I don't remember seeing. Theresa: Because they're not easy to get into, even if you, you know, you're perfectly able to climb up. It's, but it's a wonderful way to see more than just the main street of the island, it takes you to the interior. You can see the fort, you see Arch Rock, which has a great overlook, although you don't get a lot of time there, but it gives you a really good overview of the island. And then we did one of the premium excursions and I think they said 50 people signed up for it, which is almost half. Well, I guess it's a third, a third of our ship, you know, it was lunching at the Grand Hotel, which is the iconic Mackinac Island building. I mean, it's a huge Greek revival as the longest porch in the world of any building. And it's just magnificent. It was also chilly there. Remember we are on the first cruise of the season, just be sure to layer, pack the right things, but it was just a fantastic experience. It is a buffet, which is never my favorite thing, but just to be in the thousand seat dining room in the wonderful decor and to explore the hotel itself was wonderful. We could go, we went up to the cupola to get photos. That's another place. That's not really accessible. You can go up and then you have to walk up two sets of staircases. So that is something to consider, but there are plenty of great views from the porch. Robert: The Grand Hotel does sit up on a hill so that the road going up is a, is a good incline and the horse carriages slow down when they go through there. It's walkable. There's a nice sidewalk. It's beautiful. Once you get to the hotel, there are ramps. The front of the hotel has quite an imposing staircase that takes you up to the main entrance. But on the end, facing the hotel on the right end, there's Sadie's ice cream parlor, and there's a nice winding ramp that you can walk up and it will take you into the entrance for the lower level. Theresa: Part of what we're doing here today is point out what you can do. And if things aren't totally accessible, let you know how to prepare. So next we went to Escanaba in the upper peninsula, but on the North shore of Lake Michigan. We had a wonderful excursion. I do not, I do not recall what the included excursion was. Robert: I think it was walking through the town. It was a walking tour through the town. Theresa: The town was all torn up. So we opted for an excursion that was a premium excursion that took us to a maple research facility that's part of Michigan State University's forestry department, and that was fascinating. We went through several plantations. Not only do they do maple trees, they do white and red pine, willow, pumpkin, squash. They're looking at the soil and the future of the growth of pines. Robert: And maple and Christmas trees, one of the more interesting research projects that they're partnering with is looking at maple syrup that is produced both from sugar maple and from red maple. It turns out that the red maple syrup that's produced doesn't support microbes and the sugar maple does. And so the red maple doesn't require the pasteurization and it has this ability to not support microbes. It's of interest to some cancer researchers who are looking to boost rehydration in cancer patients undergoing different kinds of therapies. Theresa: Great, whoever would have thought. And they do sell products and they also have an online shop. We did get, because we like pure maple syrup, as one of the other guests said, you know, they grew up in log cabin. I think we grew up with some generic thing. They mentioned that then it was like maybe 10% real syrup and it's just dropped down to no real maple syrup. So it's a treat if you can find it. And then after Escanaba, oh boy, there are some people who say, oh, if you cruise the great lakes, you don't have to worry about seasickness. Well, they never heard of the Edmund Fitzgerald, the shipwreck graveyard, or any accidents like that. These are inland seas. They're not little tiny lakes. I mean, there can be humongous waves and we got to experience them last night. We were pitching from front to back and it went on for a long time. Many people needed some medication. Robert: No, it didn't bother you. And it seldom bothers you. No, I did get queasy. Oh, we're sitting on the top deck of Victory One and there's a rainbow. Theresa: Where? Right up there. Get a picture. Robert: There's a rainbow. You see? That's kind of cool. It's right over the lighthouse. Theresa: So after a bit of a rough night with all of that pitching, it did calm down closer to morning in Milwaukee to a nice warm and sunny day. And here we selected the included excursion, which was a tour of Milwaukee. We haven't been to Milwaukee since 2007 when we did a transcontinental bicycling tour. And honestly, we just drove through to make the car ferry that went to Muskegon, Michigan. And so we don't really know much about Milwaukee. So we boarded the bus. And right near here is an art museum that was designed by Calatrava. And it does have the potential of putting a sail up, but I don't know if you hear this. We are, you know, at a remote office on the deck of the ship. We'll say the wind has picked up immensely and I'm a little concerned about what the cruise will be like today. But Robert can tell you a bit about what we did. Robert: The entrance to the museum, as Theresa said, is actually in the shape of a sailing boat. And the sails are these long metal tubes that will fold out. They say it looks kind of like it's too windy today to actually unfold them. But they said when the wind is less than about 20 miles an hour, they can unfold, they can raise these tubes. And they said it has the wingspan of about a 747. So we saw some photographs of it and it's amazing. It's a shame we couldn't see it today. Our first stop was at the lighthouse. We got off the bus. We were able to walk around, take some nice photographs. And back on the bus. Theresa: But you could go if you were out of the bus first. And I will say the typical guess is somebody over 50 might have some physical disruptors, as I like to call them, but still wants to travel. So getting out of the bus and I'm one of the slow ones is why I don't want to trip up or down the steps. But you could have gone up to the tower, the lighthouse is up there. The lighthouse itself to the very top. And there was a gift shop there and a light keepers house that you could explore. This is the included excursion. Robert: Our next stop was the Pabst Mansion. Theresa: They told us here there was Pabst, Schlitz, Blatts, Old Milwaukee. I hope that's all. PBR obviously still around and they offered us some as we walked into the mansion and as we left, we both politely declined. The mansion is amazing. Robert: It's one of the few mansions that are still left in this particular region. The captains of industry or the people who were helping build Milwaukee up in the late 1800s built enormous mansions. And I think they said there were like three or four of them left that. Theresa: Very few left, which is unfortunate, but progress, urban renewal and the like. And it was only saved because the archdiocese of Milwaukee, Uruguay, said the archbishop and others living there. So they live there 67 years. Robert: I think they said from 1905, after Captain Pabst and his wife died, they sold the property and the archdiocese purchased it and it became a residence for the bishops there. And I believe in 1978, it was up for sale again. And a group of women put together a historical preservation society to renovate it and to bring it back to its original splendor. Supposedly the walls had all been painted white. They had put shag carpeting in. One of the docents there said that they use very cheap paint, the white paint. And so it was very easy to remove from all the woodwork. And that the carpeting rolled up very easily and it actually protected the floors. Theresa: And it is going through some renovation, especially to the exterior. We maybe didn't look hard enough to see if there was a ramp somewhere, because a lot of it was taped off, so you couldn't go there, but there is an elevator in the mansion, which we use, back of the kitchen. But we weren't sure if there's any kind of ramp. Otherwise you have to walk up stairs. Robert: We're looking out now and there's a freighter moving in front of us. It was being pulled by a tugboat. Do you see it? Theresa: We are on the fourth deck of the Victory One, and there's a spot here. We're the only ones here. Like we said, the wind picked up, but now it looks like we have a clear, it seems like a front one through. It's very nice up here. It's like we said, our first warmer day on the whole trip. Although it was in the fifties in Toronto, which for us was warm. Robert: I got distracted by the freighter moving out in front of us. Our third stop was at the St. Joan of Arc Chapel that was disassembled and then reassembled on the property of Marquette University. Theresa: The chapel, and I didn't really get the whole story. It first came from somewhere near Lyon, France, and it went to Long Island, and then it was rebuilt, and then it was disassembled again and moved to Milwaukee. And actually it's only maybe the Alcove, I would call it. That's the original and the rest has been added onto, but it's very pleasant. It's more a place for meditation. They said weddings can't happen there because it's not a church, which I'm not up to Catholicism and what they do, but I know Catholics who get married outside. So it was a little confusing, but it's very, very interesting. Robert: It was built in 1412, I believe. And then it was added on in the 1600s and it was moved in the early 1900s, I believe the first time, and then the second time was in 1960, I believe. Theresa: We were told that because of this, somebody moved it, that France does not allow anybody to move anything from France anymore, brick by brick. Well, we did just drive around. We drove by the Potawatomi Casino and some of the sports venues for Marquette. I think the Brewers. Robert: And we drove over several bridges, so it was actually a nice sightseeing bus ride, too, because we kept driving over these rivers and it's lots of interesting things to see. Theresa: And I believe they told us there are three rivers? Robert: Three rivers, yes. Theresa: We are in a nice area, a little harbor. There's a couple of lighthouses, a really nice itinerary to showcase the Midwest. And as we maybe mentioned before, a lot of people are surprised because they have misconceptions about the Midwest or what's here or if it's still like the rust belt or hasn't grown or changed since rust belt times, especially in Milwaukee, a lot of things are gone, a lot of factories, manufacturing. Robert: And tomorrow we're on our way to Chicago and we'll get there in the morning and we'll have breakfast, we'll then take a river cruise, an architectural river cruise where we go up and down the river looking at the different architecture. And then we take a flight later in the day. Theresa: After what we considered a good cruise, one of our episodes will be about the ship itself, you know, our stateroom, the food, the itinerary, the other passengers, what's included, what's not, positives, negatives, anything that you might need to know. So thank you for listening to Living the Qud Life. We'll be back next week. Show Notes

Music

Mentioned in Living the Could Life

Victory Cruise Lines

The Grand Hotel, Mackinac Island

The Westin Harbour Castle, Toronto

Toronto to Chicago, Cruising on Victory

Robert and Theresa — Wed, 29 Apr 2026 03:04:03 +0000

Alternatives to Ocean Cruising.

In this episode we focus on a voyage that visits all five Great Lakes. For some the idea is curious and unusual. Others understand the draw of these great lakes.

Transcript

Click Here for Transcript Theresa: We are currently in Toronto and about ready or getting ready to board the Victory One. Robert: We're on Ward's Island on a dock that's actually facing the Victory One, the ship that we're going to be on. It's docked next to the Viking Octantis. Theresa: And I don't know if you can hear in the background, there are a lot of birds. And I don't know if this is on any flyway. I do know that, well, I guess south of here is Rochester, New York, but when you go west in Ontario, there is a flyway that I believe goes across Pelee Island and then to the south shore of Lake Erie, where there is a very large birding and migratory area. They have a big birding event every year near, well, it's not Fort Clinton, but it's very close to one of Ohio's nice state parks with lodges called the Maumee Bay State Park. Robert: I remember coming here during the 1960s when we would come up for the summers to visit relatives in Toronto. And we're standing on the dock that we often visited and we'll be going back, back into the center part of Ward's Island to the cafe, the Island Cafe. Theresa: Which supposedly now sells beer, which wasn't allowed before. There's Ward's Center and those two connect. And Hanlan's Point. And then Hanlan's Point. We took a ferry right from near the Weston Harbourfront Castle, where we stayed last night. And on Victory, your cruise starts the night before. And that makes a lot of sense, especially if you're flying in, because we know how flights work. And we talked to a few fellow guests at registration. It seems some have come from Central California and they're surprised at how cold it is here. I think it's 50 today and we're thinking that is warm. Robert: It's a nice blue sky. Yeah, nice blue sky, 50 degrees, a very light breeze. Theresa: We've seen one of my favorite birds, but didn't hear it. That is the common loon. And maybe mallard duck, but I don't own my birds so well, especially my ducks. Looks to be that this part of the island is a wetland. So I think if you were a birder, this might be, or a ducker, I don't know. But I think this could be good for birding. Are there a lot of cottages here? Robert: And they've been here for a very long time. I remember when I was 8, 9, 10 years old, we'd come here. This was always a high point of our summer vacation when we visited relatives to come to the islands and the cottages were always there. Robert: We're on Ward's Island on a dock that's actually facing the Victory 1, the ship that we're going to be on. It's docked next to the Viking Octantis. Theresa: And I don't know if you can hear in the background, there are a lot of birds. And I don't know if this is on any flyway. I do know that, well, I guess south of here is Rochester, New York, but when you go west in Ontario, there is a flyway that I believe goes across Pelee Island and then to the south shore of Lake Erie, where there is a very large birding and migratory area. They have a big birding event every year near, well, it's not Port Clinton, but it's very close to one of Ohio's nice state parks with lodges called the Maumee Bay State Park. Robert: I remember coming here during the 1960s when we would come up for the summers to visit relatives in Toronto. And we're standing on the dock that we often visited. And we'll be going back, back into the center part of Ward's Island to the cafe, the Island Cafe. Theresa: Which supposedly now sells beer, which wasn't allowed before. There's Ward's Center and those two connect. And Hanlan's Point. And then Hanlan's Point. We took a ferry right from near the Westin Harbourfront Castle, where we stayed last night. And on Victory, your cruise starts the night before. And that makes a lot of sense, especially if you're flying in because we know how flights work. And we talked to a few fellow guests at registration. It seems some have come from Central California, and they're surprised at how cold it is here. I think it's 50 today, and we are thinking that is warm. Robert: It's a nice blue sky. Yeah, nice blue sky, 50 degrees, a very light breeze. Theresa: We've seen one of my favorite birds, but didn't hear it. That is the common loon. And maybe mallard duck, but I don't own my birds so well, especially my ducks. Looks to be that this part of the island is a wetland. So I think if you were a birder, this might be a, or a ducker, I don't know. But I think this could be good for birding. Are there a lot of cottages here? Robert: And they've been here for a very long time. I remember when I was 8, 9, 10 years old, we'd come here. This was always a high point of our summer vacation, when we visited relatives to come to the islands. And the cottages were always there. It's a tight-knit cottage community. Theresa: Victory does offer tours today of different spots in Toronto. So if you haven't been to Toronto, you could do that. We kind of like being outdoors and we have been to Toronto before. Robert: And the birds are flying in and out of this wetland. We're watching them. I wish I knew my birds. Theresa: Oh, there's the app. There's eBird and there's another one that you can listen to their song and identify the bird like that. Merlin, maybe? Something like Merlin. I don't know. So today we're doing this instead of being in the studio, we're out in the world's best studio, the great outdoors. Robert: On the great lakes. Theresa: On the great lakes in the great city of Toronto, which has grown immensely in the past decades. On Ward's Island still looks like it gets the fewest visitors, which is perfect for us because we don't like crowds. But there is a small amusement park on Center Island and an airport on Hanlan's Point. Robert: You can see turboprop planes taking off and landing there. Theresa: So we're at the farthest point we could get to on this pier across from us, like Robert said. We have the Viking Octantis, which I have had the privilege of sailing the Victory One. This will be our first time on this ship. Tomorrow, our port will be Port Colborne. We'll go to the Niagara Falls area and our excursion then will be the power plant, which looks, I mean, you see power plants all over there, all the electrical wires. So that will be really interesting. Robert: We've seen the building on opposite Niagara Falls when we've always visited the falls, but have never actually been inside or really close to it. So that's just going to be exciting to see. Theresa: Right. And I think we'll go through the Welland Canal. I always forget how to pronounce that. And that will be interesting as well. I mean, we have to get to Lake Erie, so we don't have a lot of options. And we will be boarding later and we'll be back then. We're here on our first shore excursion. We are on the Canadian side of Niagara Falls. And if you ever visit Niagara Falls, that is the best place to go to. I'm not saying anything bad about the American side, but you get a better view on the Canadian side. And we're at the top we are where the Niagara River drops into the falls. We just came back from a tour of the power tunnel, which I highly recommend. I've been to the falls many times and never realized there is a tour you go from the power station down an elevator and you walk through a tunnel that's about half a mile long and you come out right at the lower level of the river. It was a little hazy today, so we didn't get a lot of good photos, but I hope they turn out. Robert: The walkway to the overlook was very gently inclined and paved. It was smooth. It was very easy to walk. And the view was spectacular once we got outside. Theresa: And if you do have to use a wheelchair or anything else, it was smooth concrete. And like Robert said, there were some small inclines, but they even had the automatic door openers and you take an elevator down. So it's quite the nice place. We highly recommend it. Robert: We're here on a beautiful day. It's a blue sky. The mist is coming up over the falls. We can look back at the river. It's just a magnificent place to be. I remember coming here many, many years ago. We celebrated our 25th anniversary here in the winter, and it was amazing to see the falls, parts of it frozen. I would certainly recommend seeing it any time of year. Theresa: And actually most of the ice just left the river. Lake Erie pretty much entirely froze over. I think they said 95 percent, which lately has been unusual. That used to happen all the time. So there was plenty of ice coming down the river. And they do put up a metal gate so that all of the ice isn't dropping over the falls, but some still gets away. Robert: And it supposedly just cleared of ice just a couple of days ago. And we did see one of the boats that sail underneath the falls, sail into the falls, and all the passengers are wearing ponchos. And I don't know if that was the maid of the mist, or I believe there's another one. Hornblower. Hornblower, right. Theresa: I hope you can hear the river. Okay, so we are not following the usual plan. We are off on the road and out of the studio. So just actually kind of winging it with our dead cats. We will stop here, but we will try to add something in a few days. We just are leaving. We've planned our trip today for Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, which is one of the included, or the only included, shore excursion, which is absolutely fabulous. We're going back to Lake Erie. Our stop tomorrow is Detroit. And the included excursion there is the Henry Ford Museum, which is also a very good choice. However, even though it's been probably at least 20 years since we've been there, we have never been to the Detroit Institute of Art, and we are Mexicophiles and really want to see the Diego Rivera murals there. So we will do that. Thanks for joining Living the Could Life. Coming Soon! Show Notes

Music

Opening Theme “Carpe Diem” by Kevin MacLeod Licensed under Creative Commons: Attribution 4.0 http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Source: incompetech.com Interlude: "Ascending the Vale" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Closing Theme “Bloom” via Pixabay CC0 License (No attribution required) Source: pixabay.com/musicOpening Theme “Carpe Diem” by Kevin MacLeod Licensed under Creative Commons: Attribution 4.0 http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Source: incompetech.com Interlude: "Ascending the Vale" Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com) Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 4.0 License http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/ Closing Theme “Bloom” via Pixabay CC0 License (No attribution required) Source: pixabay.com/music